Season 5 Ep. 38 Who's Buying Panini?

Hello and welcome to the Ball Card Show, the sports podcast for the Esports Collector. I'm Jason Otero. I'm Gary Lomaster. This is season five, episode 38. You are looking refreshed. I am. I'm refreshed and feeling good. I slept a lot. I didn't eat as much as I normally do on vacation, although I'm not going to say I didn't eat a lot. Just not as much. I guarantee there was one night where you hammered down. Let's hear it. I don't know that there was a night that I hard hammered down. Hey, welcome to the show, by the way. Those of you that don't know, I've been on several cruises with this man. My favorite thing that he does, I do mean this in the most endearing way, is at some point within the first couple of nights, if the waiter has not realized it yet, you're not concerned with them offering certain courses and a meal. It's nice that you have a five-course meal. I think what we're going to do tonight, if it's okay with you, is I'm just going to keep eating these short ribs, and until I tell you to stop, let's just bring the short ribs. I'm not too concerned with the side salad today or the soup. That's valid. Yeah. There's always when they're like, oh, okay. He's like, no, I'm serious. I don't think you understand. Just keep bringing those. That and the butter. I need the butter. I've seen it, man. Lots of butter. My favorite was the time we finished that meal. You had five courses, and you said, you guys want to head up to Johnny Rockets? Yeah, so we can get some chili fries. My other favorite thing that you do on cruise ships is you love to go on a cruise ship and then find a way to not be near anyone. Take me to sea with 5,000 people in the same building, and then I'm going to do everything I can to find out where those 5,000 people aren't, and that's where I plant my flag for the week. Correct. That's how it tends to go. Don't expect a suntan. Right? No, no, no, no, no. I went to the beach once on this cruise. Don't expect him to talk about putting on flippers and snorkeling. Now, catamaran, you're not supposed to. Yes, I will play that game. You just want to get good and relaxed and sit there in the net. That's the entire point of vacation is like nothing, nothing at all. That's the goal. Guys, we got a lot coming up for you today, and one particular segment that I'm really excited about. It should be good. But just a quick reminder, and I want to say it if I haven't said it before, really appreciative to be able to start having some guests. Yes. We're going to be having Gordie Bonker on, Breaks with Kyle, and we have a few more coming up very, very soon as well that we're excited about. The collab with Uncle Terry has been a blast. A lot of fun. It has been quite a blast. You know what? Now that I think of it, our cousin Duncan was telling me, right? Oh. You know our cousin Duncan. Uncle Terry's been bugging him. Duncan let Terry hop on whatnot. As you could imagine, things got a little bit out of hand. Here's the clip. Rip it. Rip it. Rip it. Rip it. Rip it. Rip it. I don't know what they are. We're going to nail it. Here we go, bud. Whoa. These are damn dirty. Oh, no. They come with free sand. Hell. Look at that. Oh, no. Oh, no. What do we got? Whoa. What do we got? We got a medal of honor. Yes. Look at that. Is it a sticker? What an honor. I wish it was, but it's just a picture of a medal, but it's the medal of honor. Imagine being a little boy and getting that card. I don't want to. This card's cool, bud. There's an eagle on the back. This is so, whoa. This says welcome. Oh, boy. I'm crying tears, bud. Jeff got the case hit, I think. That's a case hit of a bald eagle, bud. Case hit, bald eagle, bro. I don't think that's real. Could you imagine getting this medal of honor as a child, pulling that out of a pack? Just taking a pen and just right on the shirt. Hey, he's my uncle, but he's your uncle, too, everybody. Uncle Terry, we appreciate you. We've got some news to jump into. We're going to talk about somebody in a business that we don't spend that much time with. I actually respect them, actually respect them. But the president of Upper Deck, Jason Masra, had a take on LinkedIn, which, by the way, didn't even know there was card content happening there. I've been told for a long time that there's a lot of good things happening on LinkedIn. I have a LinkedIn account, but I couldn't tell you what the login is. I couldn't tell you when it was updated last. Here's my understanding of it. Reddit is basically 1996 ICQ, okay? Then you have TikTok, which is early MySpace. You're picking best friends, you're kicking people out, playlists, they're letting you code and do whatever you want with it. Instagram, I thought, was the LinkedIn of the card space. But then, I guess if you're a president of a big company- LinkedIn is the LinkedIn of the card space. LinkedIn is actually the LinkedIn for professional services. It's that professional word that gets us. Yeah. Do you have LinkedIn? I wear shirts that say- Do you have one? A LinkedIn? Yeah, but I couldn't tell you when it was updated last. I couldn't tell you what the login information is. What business it was? No clue whatsoever. I'm a guy that sells sports cards, talks about sports cars, and wears shirts that say weekend forecast, 100% chance of tacos. That's getting a little bit faded. You're going to need a new taco t-shirt. I will probably eventually get one, but- You know what somebody told me this week? What did somebody tell you this week? That it's better for our brand that I just encourage you to dress like a child. Yes, 100%. I've been telling you this. It's actually better for you. You hate it so much. I just hate it, and I hate you in it. I'm glad you added something to the end of that. I wasn't sure where that was going. When you don't dress like a child, then I'm like, well, now what am I going to pick on my friend about? There is an old video from early this year where we did a show. It was a Ship Shawana video that we did, and I'm dressed very professionally. I've got a sweater vest on. It makes no sense at all. Yeah, it's uncomfortable for all of us either way, so I'm just letting you know that someone that I respect even said, just got to let that ride. Just let kids be kids. There's grown up babies out there wandering around. Let them enjoy it. All right. This is a post directly from the president of Upper Deck on LinkedIn within the last week. Speaking of volatility, speaking of the chase, speaking of speculating, I'm just going to read it word for word. Try not to stumble over it, and then I want your take on this. You and I discussed this a little bit. Some really thoughtful ... Anyway, I'm just going to jump into it. I'm talking way too much. Again, Jason Mazura with Upper Deck. He's the president. Here's what he said. Speculative. I said it wrong. Everything speculative is up right now. The stock market, Bitcoin, trading cards, and it's pricing some collectors out. Here's what the data shows. 50% of consumers spending in the US are coming from 10% of the population. Rich people are carrying the market, not just in cards, but across every category. Concert tickets, $1,000 for nosebleeds. Luxury goods, selling faster than ever. High-end collectibles, moving at record prices. When boxes cost $1,000 or more, you're not buying for fun anymore. You're speculating. You're betting, and what you buy today will be worth ... You're betting that what you buy today will be worth significantly more tomorrow, and that works until it doesn't. Sports cards have always had speculation built in. You collect a rookie, hoping for a Hall of Famer, but what's happening now is different in scale. When the markets become this speculative, they become fragile. President of Upper Deck saying this, I'm not saying the sky is falling. I'm saying we need to be honest about what is happening. This isn't sustainable growth driven by collectors who love the hobby. This is wealth concentration driving prices that most people can't participate in, and if the money suddenly moves elsewhere to bet on something else, we all feel it. That's a mic drop type of statement, at the very least. Okay. You're just whelmed, not over or under? He's not saying anything that isn't true. What other president of an organization or business like this has spoken directly to the fragility of the market? Nobody. That's not the issue. The issue isn't that he's speaking directly to the fragility of the market. That's fine, but this reads a lot like something we talked about last week when Nat Turner went on his little rampage before he bought PSA about the unfairness of PSA. Jason Masra, you run a good company. You make good products, some of the better quality control products on the market available today. Unfortunately, they're all hockey and Marvel and Looney Tunes. That's fine if you're a hockey guy or a Marvel guy or a Looney Tunes guy. Here's the issue. Your top end product, the cup, rivals Flawless and National Treasures in price point. It's a nice product. It's a beautiful product. And they're doing new stuff with authentication that I think is pretty cool. But you're not doing anything to make your products more accessible to the average collector. This idea that the hobby has never seen anything like this before is insane, okay? Just so we're all on the same page. Everything's a matter of scale. Let's look at it from just a time-over-time standpoint, right? Prism, we'll use Prism because it's kind of the flagship, everybody-knows-it product. Prior to the COVID boom, Prism hobby boxes were about $220 retail. They during COVID got up to about $1,100 and now they're between $800 and $1,000, right? So we're three and a half times, right? In a five-year window. In a five-year window, sure. How much did a pack of tops baseball cost in 1989? I don't know. 35 cents. 35 cents. Yep. And then Upper Deck came out at what? I was four, by the way. So I was just- What did Upper Deck come out at? They were the premium product. A dollar. They were the premium product. And what is that? About three times. Okay, this has happened before and it'll continue to happen. We're not, yes, currently the super high end of the market is being pushed by the Mr. Wonderfuls and the Shines and those guys that are doing that stuff. That's fine. No problem. I saw a deal get offered on Facebook this week of all places. People who say big money doesn't move on Facebook don't know what they're talking about. The Bowman Chrome Superfractor Otani rookie surfaced in a group on Facebook this week, right? And it hadn't been surfaced for years and the guy turned down three and a half million dollars. There was a three and a half million dollar offer and he was like, no, we're not even close. Which, by the way, to those of you being critical of Facebook, many times those types of things are show and tell. But we interviewed Gordy, who was involved in brokering a deal for over a million dollars on a mantle and that came out of a not so large Facebook group that we're a part of. So at the end of the day, what he's talking about, he's not saying anything that's incorrect. I would say that my response to him would be this, what are you going to do about it? Because if all you're going to do about it is continue to ride the wave and eke out as much profit as you can while you can, then these are just words and they don't really matter. That's my response. What should the introductory price be for the cup? If it's important that we balance this out, that it's not all a speculative market that only the wealthy can participate in, what should we expect? What should we see? We shouldn't expect anything. That's the thing. Everything he's saying right here is irrelevant because every business on the face of planet earth prices in response to consumer demand. You know what'll make them lower the price of the cup? People quit buying it. Yep. And they quit buying it in scale. Now I do understand this and then correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure Upper Deck is not giving direct accounts to anyone that does not have a brick and mortar. You can have an existing breaking business that's reputable, been around a long time. They're not in that regard. You've got to buy from a distributor. In that regard, they are protecting that demand on the wax entry level pricing. Yeah, the problem is again though, even though- It's not stopping a shop from breaking it though, right? Correct. Yeah. And it doesn't stop a shop from getting it. Even if you don't have a direct account, you can get it from a distributor. They still have a distributor network. The issue again, like most people in these positions who say this type of stuff, it's this way of trying to make yourself seem like you're on the little guy's side, but you're not. You're trying to eke as much profit out of what you have as you possibly can. You talked about this, the bifurcation, right? The bifurcation of economics. So big word, all we're saying is we've seen more, especially in the space and in our current economy. There's two economies. Don't interrupt me when I'm trying to make one point. There's haves and have nots in the space and there doesn't seem to be a whole lot in the middle and that's happening more and more in our current economy. So the question is, was someone like this really about to restructure to move that to the 90% instead of the 10? Probably not. Probably not. So I do like that the conversation is happening. I do like that it's like, hey guys, there's speculation here. There's a ton of fragility. There is a gamble involved. I'm encouraged to hear the leadership just call that what it is, but there's not necessarily a solution in place because the solution is in the hands of the people getting their money out and getting the card out and continuing to pay those prices for it. At the end of the day, the consumer drives it. You can say that the breakers are driving it. Guess who pays the breakers' bills? Y'all. You guys. Guess who pays the bills? Yep. I did think it was thought-provoking. I thought it was a thoughtful reaction. It wasn't just like a click-baity thing. Good conversation. So hopefully we see the cup drop at $2.99. I might get into hockey at that point. Absolutely. Absolutely. It's a beautiful product. It'd be a great price point. Let's talk about, I don't want to beat this to death, but we've been talking about PSA and maybe they're flirting with repacks and you guys said, no, no way. GameStop's really starting to get involved in the repacks. Nah, they're a gaming place, blah, blah, blah. On and on and on, here we are, but this week, here's what we've been seeing. Just exactly what's gonna happen when PSA has their own repack product and they have their own digital repack in a brick and mortar location within 30 minutes of anybody. And if you wanna get real deep in the weeds of, I don't wanna call it a conspiracy theory because I think it's more credible than that, they're offering well over 100% on some cards and most of them are eights and nines. Yeah, that's just where I was getting ready to head. Yeah. It's not just anything either. I saw a post this week where somebody had a few, it was either PSA eights or PSA nines, late nineties Jordan inserts that have some value, probably around a few hundred bucks and PSA is offering them like 190, 250, like crazy percentages on these cards. Let me ask you a question, why? Why? Two reasons. Well, what happens when that transaction takes place? Well, you're setting a comp. So does that hit on card ladder when PSA buys it? That I'm not sure of. That's a really important question to get answered. Yeah. We should have an answer to that. Yeah, that's what we can find out about, but yeah, that's one potential thing there. The other kind of like, this is where it gets a little conspiracy theory-ish, be really interesting to see if the pop starts increasing on nines and tens on these cards. Find up a bunch of eights and nines will do two things. One, if you actually put a dent in the market, those can be $300 cards now. Yeah, you control the market at that point. If you're able to grade an eight or a nine and make it more valuable, well now you've really got an opportunity. Now, for those of you saying, that's ridiculous. You said we were ridiculous a month ago. You said we were ridiculous six months ago. We're not going to stop being ridiculous now. We're just saying maybe keep an eye on it. What's happening there. Not sure it's healthy, not sure it's on the up and up. And for those of you that are dealers, I will say this. If you're a dealer and you keep a lot of slabs in your showcases, and you're getting fatigued with everyone trying to beat you up on price. So I don't like this approach because it creates a tug of war. But for some people it makes the most sense. Scan those and see what PSA is offering and write it on the back. Sports card guys. Man, I hope I didn't say it wrong. Jasper, Indiana, close to my hometown. Just talked with him at Midwest Mines. That's one of the things he started putting on the back. Because when everybody's throwing crazy numbers at him on a slab that he knows liquid, you can just show them, hey, PSA's offering this right now. I've done that with a few things, especially, you're talking about Jordan stuff. I've got a extremely low pop, like a pop 21, early 90s Jordan PSA 10. It's a baseball Jordan, but still, it's like one of the lowest pop paper Jordans that exists. It hasn't sold in a year and a half. The last sale was like 130 bucks. The PSA buyback offer is well over $200 right now. The eights are weird right now. Nines are, too. Now, I don't know if you guys noticed this. That GOAT market that was flying going into the fall, it's plateauing a little bit, leveling out. The good news is it usually doesn't crash again. It just kind of finds a new spot. But that has started to happen as well. So, there's a reason you're being offered over 100%. The question you should ask is why, and just make a mental note of that and keep track of it down the road. The other thing that I would think is if PSA all of a sudden wants to offer me $300 for my card that I think is worth 150, I'm the kind of guy that's like, I want to wait and see why, because I might have $500 in a year and I don't know it. I'll take the three right now. Yeah, you'll take the three right now. Just depends. Worth checking, but just know you're feeding the beast, all right? Speaking of GameStop. Yeah. Multiple sources have stated that GameStop has representatives walking around some of the largest shows in the country buying and buying heavy, like on slaps, buying at 93 to 97%. So, is GameStop the way that PSA keeps their noses clean when it comes to how that works? Maybe, either that or PSA just buys a controlling share of GameStock and calls it a day. Yeah, yeah. I've said for a while, you can go back to the audio versions of the podcast from a couple years ago, that I think that GameStop is going to become the franchise. Oh, it's happening, it's clearly happening. For sports cards. Like, Fanatics is going to be a big part of that, but they're going to become primarily a card shop that has a few video games. Well, because what are you missing out on? Like, you and I have talked about this. The primary reason for the brick and mortar in the timeline we were originally considering was that we would have a place where the opportunity to buy comes walking to us. Yes. Just because you have an online platform doesn't mean people understand it. There's so many collectors out there that have slabs that have never submitted a card for grading, that are terrified of messing with that. They've heard stories, but they'll walk into a brick and mortar and say, what do you give me for these? All over and over and over. And when you have a place where there are multiple hobbies selling out of the same shop, that kid will be like, I'm over cards. I want the new Xbox, right? Take them in, unload them. You got a brick and mortar, super smart for their repack. But yeah, they're going to be grabbing a little more of a market share than a lot of people realize with the way this is going. Especially if they're buying those other ones. For dealers, this is great. I want more people paying 95%. I want to be able to cash in. If as long as I can keep buying it, then I'm happy with that. Speaking of sales, the big rumor. The big rumor that has been all the news going around. And we got messages. People, what do you think about this? Is this really happening? Is that really happening? Is Panini for sale? Is it selling to fanatics? And we are here to say, we don't know and neither do you. Yeah, I think it's very credible that Panini is putting themselves on the market. Now you reached out. Yeah, I reached out to Mike Geo. From Sportscard Nonsense, friend of ours, colleague of ours. And he's very tied into the fanatics world. And what was his response on the record? He's like, there's nothing to this. You know, everything that they're hearing is that there's not even an interest from fanatics part to make that purchase. Now, silence would be a little more of a maybe, but to come out and say, this isn't happening when you're in the middle of having gone back and forth with these legal issues. So it's like, I guess here's the question. Panini is losing, you know, it's lost these licenses when it once was this powerhouse. When I got into the hobby, Panini was the unmovable force. Yes, it was the lion's share of the market. They were setting the prices. You heard us griping about Panini. And when we heard that Topps was sold, our first reaction was like, oh no, the brand is gone? What's happening? Then we learned fanatics comes in. We're like, oh, this is a good thing. Little by little by little, we're in the spot where if you're Panini and you're selling, what are you worth? What's the value? So Gary, help us break down. So to be really clear, everything that we have looked into, the people we've reached out to, the people that have commented quickly on this, like Mike Geo with Sports Cards Nonsense, check out their media network. Gordy's on there that we interviewed last week. Great content. But if people like this are stepping up and saying right away, it seems pretty clear this isn't true, as bad as you and I want to believe a crazy story like this could be happening, right? Or as much as you may be like, no way, no way, it doesn't seem to be happening. But what would be Panini's play here? Well, I think that what's probably not happening is fanatics. It's what it sounds like. Now, could that change? Sure, but somebody that we trust who's tied into that whole world says it doesn't sound like that's gonna happen. Panini is gonna try to sell those. So the value is, the peak of their value was about two and a half years ago. And they had an agreement in principle to sell to fanatics at that point, but Panini turned around and fanatics found out that they had been cooking the books to inflate their value. So fanatics was like, nah, we're out. And then Panini was like, okay, what do we do now? I guess we just try to milk this thing. At this point, the only legitimate value they have is in the brand IPs, because they have soccer licenses, but they're not exclusive. Tops also has those. They have a few NIL licenses that are exclusive, like they have Ohio State, they have Jeremiah Smith and some individual athletes that are exclusive to them. But at the end of the day, the value is in the brands of Prism and National Treasures and Flawless. And let's not forget what these case hits have become. Yeah, yeah. The case hits themselves have that kind of value. And that's the value. So the number that is being speculated is they're wanting somewhere between three and three and a half billion dollars. I don't, I agree with Mike, I don't know that fanatics buys them for a lot of reasons, but Michael Rubin strikes me as the kind of guy who if you try to screw him, you're just gonna get a middle finger from then on. Like that's it, the end. I mean, his Facebook profile picture is him with dual birds flipping off the camera. Yeah. Johnny Cash style. Yeah, so I think he's done with Panini. So what does Panini do? What are their options? They can sell to Upper Deck maybe, I don't know. I don't know how much sense that makes. They can just continue to operate in this weird nebulous space where they have soccer and they do Prism releases of the Rolling Stones. Do Leaf and Wild Card have the money for something like that, that kind of a play? I don't think that those two combined have that kind of money for that kind of a play. It would be wild if that happened. Those two kind of have their own lane. Do people realize Wild Card actually had better designs for the case hit type of stuff? I mean, that's the thing, Wild Card and Leaf both have their own lanes, and listen. They are what they are. As a dealer, I loathe Wild Card. It's impossible to sell, nobody wants it at shows when they're coming up to buy stuff, but you know who really likes it? People who want to rip a product cheap. People rip the hell out of that stuff. And if you sell on eBay, some of those do have a little bit of value. Leaf has its own lane. It's a very different lane, but they're pretty successful within that lane, so I don't know how much sense it makes for them to try to team up with somebody or do it on their own and try to stretch that way. The Leaf one is interesting to me because of their ability to create some pretty nice products that are not licensed. Gorgeous products. Like, think of Pop Century, think of Leaf Trinity. Think of, what's the historical booklet one that they run out of? Oh, history books. It's a great product. There's some cool products out there where you could take on some case hits, you could take on some of those brands. You wouldn't take all, maybe you have like a Chronicles type of product, but it's a higher end and it's all the Kabooms, the Downtowns, that kind of stuff that you were familiar with. Sure, but do they have three billion dollars to go make that purchase? And what's stopping that from like, people just waiting for that to kind of bleed out and then? Because it doesn't matter. If Panini International isn't gonna stop, we're talking about Panini America. So if Panini America just goes out, we didn't find a buyer and they shutter their operations, nobody can make Prism. They own that, right? And they'll still make Prism Soccer, they'll still do those things, they'll still make stickers and non-sport stuff. We get really caught up in this like North American centric viewpoint. There's a whole planet out there that also buys sports cards that don't care about any of the stuff we care about. And that's only gonna happen more. Fanatics is like verbalized, we are dedicated to growing the collector base internationally. Huge focus for them. Obviously Fanatics Fest in Germany next year, they're like, there's different stuff. Also, have you been paying attention to how many NFL games are happening overseas now? Jacksonville wants to move permanently to London. Their owner wants that to happen. Yeah, you know, Gary, we have been accused of sometimes like stirring up conspiracies or there's things that aren't true. But when you look back at the GameStop and PSA thing, we were right, we weren't wrong. When we said, hey, they're offering this promotion, it sure looks like they're positioning themselves for a repack and everybody's like, no, it's just a promo. A few months later, GameStop, working with them, digital repack and now GameStop is buying up the Dallas card show at 95%. Here we are. So maybe Fanatics isn't buying Panini. But what if they were? Like, what if we fast forward to the year 2030? Five years from now. How is it five years from now is 2030? I know, I know, I know. If it's 2030, what would it look like? And I think we just, should we just go for it? Like put on a tinfoil hat and just say what might happen? I mean, that would be fun. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. Okay. So it's, what? What year is it? In the year 2030. In the year 2030, Fanatics rolls out a brand new product. The Fanatics HELOC, where you can leverage the equity of your home for a chance to chase the next one of one, Anthony Richardson. In the year 2030. I like that. Yeah. Fanatics has sued Merriam-Webster in order to force them to change the definition of the word degenerate into the definition of the word collector. They lose the suit and promptly purchase the Merriam-Webster Corporation. Math checks out. In the year 2030. In the year 2030, Fanatics wants to deliver you an experience that you've never had before. Sure, you can have an MLB debut patch, but what if you could have something before that? We introduce to you today, the Delivery Room debut patch. A swatch of organic umbilical cord, infused with stem cells, so that you can say, I had their best card first. In the year 2030. What if Upper Deck buys Panini? Well, I'd have to be wearing a tinfoil hat to. Even consider that? In the year 2030. Upper Deck purchases Panini, and they immediately make up for lost time and begin printing Otani and Judge rookie cards as fast as the presses can roll them out. For years and years and years? Rookie cards that have already happened? Yes. We must be living in the future. It's the year 2030. Upper Deck bought Panini. It's the year 2030. And replacing the Upper Deck hologram on the back. Will be a logo of Tim Hortons and hologram foil in the year 2030 The cup the flagship product from upper deck They now contain actual game used cups But what if like what if upper deck didn't buy it what if like Ryan Johnson from card collector to bought it hit me with a 20 30. Oh 30. I like this one in the year 2030 in the year 2030 When Ryan Johnson of card collector 2 was asked how he felt about purchasing panini. He was quoted saying and I quote oh For sure 100% oh my gosh. Oh my goodness in the year 2030 What if in the year 2030 it's not card collector 2 that purchases panini, but what if it was Eric Michael who purchased In his voice or Sorry in the year 2030 2030 Eric Michael learns that his army of AI bots purchased panini five years ago Also, he learned that muggsy Bogues kabooms list him at six foot tall In the year 2030 You got this in the year 2030 Eric Michael is stunned with shock That panini or anyone for that matter has accepted one of his offers In the year 2030 What if what if it wasn't Eric Michael? What if it was? the Unshakable unmovable force that drives the hobby that purchased panini Hello 2030 What if it was Jeff Wilson in the year 2030 it's 2030 and Jeff Wilson has expanded his cards HQ Empire to eight locations All of them divided by partition walls in an abandoned Piggly Wiggly the same one the same one Just eight doors There's eight doors There's walls It's a it's a shot. What year is it? It's the year 2030 it is 2030 and listen Jeff's wife just bought him panini and when I say it was her I mean there were no PPP loans involved Zero, it was a gift zero. I don't want to Gary. It was a gift. Yes It's a birthday Zero PPP funds went into it. I just want to make sure everybody knows Here's 2030. It was a gift from his wife from his wife zero PPP loans. Yes in the year 2030 It's your best that's all you got for me. Okay Jeff decided Now that he owns panini to drop a new case hit It's called the pick me Featuring athletes who are begging for all the attention they can get As we're wearing tinfoil has our studio roasted people. That's a potential look so guys. We don't want to get carried away with this These are toasty warm now, I'm thinking much more rationally now that I've taken that off Same here as I put my sheets hat back on that was a lot to get through but man We're in a time machine I feel like we're in a time machine. I wanted flashlights in a dark room. You said no. No, we ain't doing that Shout out to Conan O'Brien with one of the better inspiration. Yes quick before we finish up a couple things We want to update you with I'm gonna give you a show schedule and remind you what not will be changing days We're going to two days a week Deal for us jazz hands Tuesdays at 6 o'clock and Sundays at 430 that starts November the 11th So if you've been joining us for one day, we're now two days Tuesday and Sunday So be sure to bookmark follow all that kind of stuff if you want to stay up-to-date with that and then show schedule for the Next several weeks you want to run that down Gary? Yeah, so starting on the 9th we will be at Grove said Grove City for the Grove City card fest that's b-sports and card collector to show then on the 15th We will be at Eastgate November 15th Cincinnati at the Eastgate mall always a great show Right now 22nd 23rd is kind of up in the air. I'm sure we will be some place We just don't know where yet and then December 6th another b-sports show over just north of Fort Wayne in Auburn, Indiana At the Fort another really great show with a lot of really great dealers good spot to do your Shopping for those Christmas gifts for the collector in your life and then December the 13th at Xenia and then the last show before Christmas will be Eastgate once again on The 20th and then we'll have a couple weeks where we get to just spend some time with our families some really cool interviews coming Up not to get too specific with it, but somebody who's focusing in on the higher-end super niche one player market Yeah, really interesting topic an LCS owner locally willing to talk about what it's been like owning a shop all these years the changes with fanatics How the dynamic is changing in the hobby looking forward to that and then we also have one that we're really excited about Somebody that is currently in the MLB Stumbled onto the pod loves cards. Can't wait to share that with you So yes, stay in touch subscribe follow all that fun stuff to stay in the loop Hopefully we see you in one of the whatnot shows on socials. Be sure to give us a follow We appreciate all of you. This has been the ball card show these sports podcasts for the sports collector. Bye now. Peace You