Passion to Profession: Building a 20-Year Sports Card Business with Leighton Sheldon

Foreign. Here on the Stacking Slabs Network presented by my good friends at ebay. It is that time of the week where we dig into the entrepreneurial and operational journey of people building cool things in the sports card industry. And I have an individual who I've been following, listening to for quite some time. I got my man Leighton Sheldon from the Just Collect team to talk about his many years building a brand, building a business, and most importantly, building trust in the sports card industry. Really fun conversation. It was awesome getting the opportunity to connect with Leighton. I think you'll all really enjoy this conversation. If you want to show your support for the broader Stacking Slabs network, hit the follow button, tell a damn friend, run on over to the Patreon Group, shout out ebay for supporting these conversations. We would not be able to do it without the biggest, the baddest, the best marketplace for, for buying, selling your trading cards across the universe. For now, let's get into the chat. Leighton Sheldon. Just Collect. What's going on everybody? Welcome back to another episode of Passionate Profession brought to you by my good friends at ebay. This conversation is going to be a lot of fun. I have been a longtime Fleer of today's guest. He has been in business for quite some time. Wealth of knowledge, a lot of insight and information I would assume might come from the vintage side of the hobby, knowing what he primarily buys and collects. Today I am joined by Leighton Sheldon who is the owner at Just Collect. Leighton, welcome man. How are you? I'm excellent, thanks Brett. I'm also the co founder of Auction Wire. Co founder of Auction Wire. Let's plug it out of the gates. Auction Wire has definitely been something that I have heard come up in conversations throughout the hobby. A lot on Jeremy show sports cards live, maybe give a snapshot of getting into kind of the tech space and creating a solution for the hobby. Like what was the catalyst? Where'd that come from? Sure. Well, that was really simple. That was from my own anguish. So, you know, literally on a given day I started to just keep track at first very loosely, Brett. In other words, I started working at this time, I ended at this time. What did I do for the last two and a half hours? And like you're telling me, the only thing I did for the last two and a half hours was just surf various websites trying to find various players sets and different cards. And keep in mind, I'm not a tech guy by trade, but my first business partner and just collect. Scott was a tech guy and I've always utilized it and been able to leverage it in my business, I think fairly well. And so fast forward from there. I saw the need and the problem. I didn't have the solution. I had an idea of it and I talked about it on my very own podcast. And then what happened was kind of like a mutual friend slash acquaintance reached out and said, you know, I've been thinking about doing something tech related, but I'm a collector. Let me talk to you more about your idea and what your vision is at this point. That's now over a year ago. Enter another party. His name is Ryan Hotchkiss, who's not only a collector, but he's an investor in Auction Wire. And we feel that we are the largest virtual online card show in the world. And that's really exciting, Brett, because when we were leaving the national, many of us, myself included, as great as that high was being there, you're kind of like, oh, well, Fanatics Fest is, you know, 11 months in the future, right? Meaning the next one, the next national is not for 355 days. And even though there's plenty, plenty of wonderful shows across the country, shout out to a couple of them, right. Burbank and the Philly show and many in between, it's still not necessarily what I'm looking for as an experience. Right. Because I can't head to every show. And so what I found over, let's say, my couple decades of being in the space, that there was this professional side of me that wanted to have a better experience, but then there was the personal side. Because as much as I love the stuff, if I could tell you you could shrink down the amount of the heavy lifting to find your card from making it up three hours a week to five minutes, I would personally really like that. And so that's the lens I was looking at initially Auction Wire, before it even was Auction Wire. And I'm really grateful to where we are today, but even more excited about where we're going in the future. What do you think is it about this space? Obviously, like you, there's. You have to be very entrepreneurial in order to run the business that you've been running at. Just collect and then obviously, like there's. You meet a lot of people along the way and you have a specific skill set and you meet other people's with skills and then you've got an idea and something like Auction Wire pops up and you decide to go all in and build it and make it happen. Like in your years of building in this space, whether it's you know, software or your business. Like, what do you think it is about the sports card industry that makes it just like such a great breeding ground for entrepreneurs? Sure. So first, in the scheme of things, it's very young. It's a very young industry. It may look like we're in accelerated growth happening right now because of the Fanatics effect, and that's wonderful. In most people's eyes, it's wonderful. However, there is no doubt that if you looked at medical supplies, automobiles, meaning these are industries that are far more mature. They've been around for longer, they've embraced technology decades before. And so for us, candidly. Right. I think we're similar age, Brett. We've been collectors for so long that we remember collecting when there was no Internet. I hate to date us, right? But there. There was a time, albeit I was very young, and I remember hearing about a place called America Online, and there was message boards, and it was so exciting to go from the English Town auction or the Howell Flea Market or the Steinbeck Mall show, and then go onto these chat boards and say, Well, I have this 93 Finest Refractor for $82, and you have something I want. Well, maybe we could do a cash trade. And so that really helped springboard where we are today. But as far as entrepreneurship, I really think it's a function of passion, meaning on my part, the space itself being ripe for innovation. And I think that our space, meaning the hobby, whatever we believe that is today, is right for it. But partly because of what I had just talked about, we're still kind of youngish in that journey. Right. We've not been around for hundreds of years or longer, you know, in some cases for some industries. I love the AOL call out. I was just catching up with a buddy yesterday. We haven't spoken in like 20 years. But when we were kids and AOL came out and the message boards hit, we set up a little LLC for our sports cards and collectibles business. And he reminded me of it, and he was asking me about what I'm doing today, and we were talking through it. But there's been a lot of iterations and a lot of eras and a lot of ways to kind of buy, sell, trade online in person, and it's just a ton of fun. Maybe take us back to kind of like the moment that sports cards and collectibles kind of sunk its teeth in you. I know on your site it says you. You set up at your first card show, you know, in 89, and you've kind of been off to the races ever since. What is it about sports cards that you're attracted to? Sure. I think it's the way that it makes me feel. I feel very energized. Even if I'm just looking at cards for myself to pursue just for the sheer enjoyment of looking at them. I do absolutely consider myself to be an entrepreneur. And I've always enjoyed how I believed at a very young age that you have this wonderful. These little collectibles. I felt like we were very lucky to be able to handle them. Meaning, like some of these rarities should all be in a museum locked up. And we're able to not only handle them, some cases, collect them and hang onto them for a long time. In other cases, like, wait a minute, I'm allowed to buy this Babe Ruth card and then sell it for more. I could use the profit to build a business. And I'm like, you're kidding me, right? So really that's the way I've looked at it ever since the beginning. And of course, as you said, many iterations, Brett, a lot of mistakes. You know, it's nothing is straight up. But I would say that once I realized, like many of us, most of us, in fact, that are passionate about sports at a young age, but realize we likely one-of-one be taking that professional route, I felt for me it was a really great way to stay involved with sports, even if it was on the fringe, because I didn't know I'd do this for a living when I was Zebra young. And I think that all of that coupled with how strong nostalgia is so. Right. Keep in mind that I'm lucky I get to do this for a living. There's other people, Brett, they would love to be in your spot. Maybe like your buddy, maybe he's in a corporate job, he just doesn't like it anymore. And to be fair, 20 years ago, you and I were probably looked at as we were crazy to get a full time job in this because you Goldin really get a good full time job in this space. And so that may, you know, have come full circle now. And even though my son is 11 or your daughters were younger, may never seek employment in the space. I'm really proud that if they want to, they can. And that's. That's something that's very exciting to me. So you started off in this industry. I don't where we'll both just caveat, say world guys talking about this or perceived old guys maybe based on some of the Instagram reels that populate our algorithm. But you know, the infrastructure back when you got going wasn't there. The opportunities probably weren't. Is out in the open, less like blueprint for this is how you get started and kind of post college. Like, I'm curious, like, how did you end up pursuing a path in sports cards and collectibles as opposed to kind of taking the, the traditional path that many of us take where we graduate, Then we get some entry level job at some corporate entity. Like maybe share your story on how you got up and running. Sure, I'll try to do it succinctly for you and your audience. Brett. When I was graduating college, I graduated Rutgers College in 2000, and if I remember correctly, at the time, the job market was very hot, meaning you could get a fair number of entry level jobs. I had a degree in, I think marketing from the Rutgers School of Business. So it just meant that I could at least get, call it a 40 or $50,000 entry level job. And they were happy to hire me for it. And although I was excited for it, I also worked at Johnson and Johnson when I was in college for a couple years and had a great experience. And I used a lot of that money that I earned there to parlay that into buying baseball cards. I'm sure you're shocked. And so all the while I decided to go to a state school because it was more economical. And so when I graduated Rutgers, I'm sure this day and age is probably a little more challenging because of pricing and inflation, but I graduated with no debt. And so that didn't mean I had money to get a place. That didn't mean I had really any money at all. But I didn't have anyone I owed money to. It was a strange feeling. Meaning, you know, your whole life, right, people are telling you, you gotta do this, you gotta do that, do your homework right, finish your dinner before you get dessert, those kinds of things. So I decided to do the on campus interviewing. And it was a very popular thing at many major universities. And so I think it was like Anderson Consulting at the time was a big six accounting firm. I wanted to go into business consulting. And I remember one of the questions that they asked me or we were discussing was, hey, you know, how do you feel if we gave you $2,500 as a signing bonus for suits? And I remember thinking, Yu-Gi-Oh that's a lot of money for suits. What if I just didn't want to wear a suit and I just saved the money as like for down payment for an apartment? I'M making it up, right? And of course, this is where some of the cracks started showing the pavement, Brett. They're like, oh, no, silly, that money so that you can buy the suits and wear them to work. And of course I'm thinking, I'm not an idiot. I figure, you want me to wear the suits to work. So my next question is, how many days a week do I have to wear a suit? And they're like, well, you know, definitely Monday through Thursday and Friday is dress down day. And of course, they're starting to have caveats for dress down day. I'm like, wait a minute, you're telling me on dress down day there's still rules? And so, needless to say, I wasn't really playing games. I was not feeling that great about the opportunity. And to be fair, Brett, if they were paying $150,000, maybe I would have been thrilled to get some suits. And so it dawned on me kind of early on, meaning in the recruitment process of getting that first corporate job. Plus, I was already at J and J. I'm like, I don't really like the sound of this. So on a whim, I decided to reach out to a few different people in the space. Keep in mind, it looked vastly different then, Brett, than it does today. There was no Fanatics to ask or anything like that. And I contacted a few folks, including Mark Murphy, the baseball card kid who's no longer in business. And also, I just told the story at the national this past year. I also called Kit Young, and I remember telling kid over the phone. I mean, it was a precocious young kid, very confident. I'm like, kid, I got this degree. I'm ready to move to San Diego. He's ready to have me, Brett. And I'm like, great, how much does it pay? He's like, well, I think we could start you at 1450 an hour. I'm like, no, no, you didn't hear me, Kit. I have a college degree. I'm screaming as if he can't hear me. And of course, all the joking aside, Brett, I realized that it was going to be challenging to potentially get a job in this space, meaning the hobby, for any decent amount of money. And then I got a little bit of a break. This guy named Mark Murphy, the baseball card kid, who was really the unopened specialist before Steve Hart, was willing to give me a chance to effectively run his day to day operations. And believe it or not, he offered me what I was going to be earning for Anderson Consulting. And so the ICING on the cake for me was I had asked him, because he specialized in unopened, if it was okay if I dabbled and bought and sold single carts. Because if I could do that in my own brain, Brett, even if I can only make 5,000 bucks extra or $10,000 extra, I'll now be making more in my first year than I would be at this corporate job, which I didn't really want. And then, of course, if it doesn't work out in a year or two, I'm just going to go back and get a regular job in corporate America. That's quite the story, I think. So much of this is about timing and opportunities. And obviously, like, you had to have left some sort of impression on Mark for him to, you know, pay you the salary that, you know, a consulting firm was going to pay you and take the chance on you, a young college kid at the time, what. What do you think he saw in you to take that risk for bringing you in and run the operations and, you know, buy and sell singles? Like, what do you think it was? What was the thing that stood out? It's a great question, Brett. Certainly the enthusiasm. Absolutely. The enthusiasm and the energy. I was very, very excited to do something short of playing second base for the Yankees. I made him know at the time the Yankees come calling, the jets, who, by the way, which is insane, Brett, 20 years later, are still struggling at quarterback, which is completely disgusting. But I did say at the time, I said, if there's any tryouts or anything like that, like, and I can go, like, I'm going to go. And of course, you know, we had the gentleman's agreement. Sure, bud. You know, you could do that. Great. I think that he was excited by that. And I, to be fair, I guess a little bit of it was I showed tremendous business acumen in school, meaning I bought and sold cards my way through college. I didn't have any debt. And then I used Johnson and Johnson as a springboard to not only start to accumulate some wealth, I. E. The capital I needed to start making some more money, but I did figure out. Cause he asked me, he's like, why don't you just work at Johnson and Johnson? And I said, oh, well, that's where I'm going to go if this job doesn't work out. Meaning I was very confident, like, I want to try this. If you don't want to try this with me, totally. Okay. But I think I'm a good bet for you, and I don't think that many people are going to call you willing to work as hard as I do, have as much experience already, and, you know, put forth the effort. So getting into that seat and working in this space, when did you identify for yourself that this was something that you could eventually go out and pursue on your own and build a company around? Like, what were those moments during that run that gave you the confidence to kind of start just collecting? Sure. So I would say more of it happened when I went to Leland, so I'll try to be brief. I was working for Mark for about two years, you know, post graduation of college, and at some point in the second year. And once again, if Mark's listening, I'm forever grateful. I don't think he is listening, but I realized at some point in my second year, Brett, my growth was going to be stymied there. Meaning he was a small organization. There really wasn't anywhere to go other than to take over his business. That didn't seem to be a logical step for me. And so at the same time, you're talking about timing and it being fortuitous. So a company, an auction house by the name of Lelands, headed by Josh Evans, may he rest in peace, and Mike Hefner, apparently were looking for a card guy. That's literally how the job was described to me. And so a common friend that we had, his name was Rich Albersheim, who was both friends with Josh and Hef, and him and I became friends through Mark. This gentleman named Rich had referred me to Leland's and said, you should give this kid an interview, See if, you know, it's a good spot for him. And so I didn't have the experience they were looking for, but I also didn't cost maybe as much as, you know, some of the other more experienced people they were meeting. And, you know, once again, I think that the energy I was showing how excited I was. And that's really where I would say, not only did I cut my teeth big time, but I realized there, Brett, I'm like, oh, my God, this industry is so exciting. Beyond just cards. I got to experience firsthand Babe Ruth flannel jerseys that now sell for 10 or 20 million dollars. Got incredible educations with some Negro league and Puerto Rican baseball memorabilia that now sells for, like, a small fortune compared to what it sold for 20 years ago. If you ever saw the movie Short Circuit, the Robot, I was like, more data, more input. I loved it all. I mean, I was this person, Brett. I took, once again, per the advisement of Josh and Hef, my first auction Catalog. I remember the auction's over. You know, you help build these auctions. And I'm like, oh, that was great. And they're like, you know, you think all your work's done for this auction? I said, Yu-Gi-Oh you know, stuff sold. They said, you know what, lady? This is what we want you to do. We want you to go through the catalog and for every single lot, we want you to write down what it's sold for. I'm like, that sounds insane. Like a punishment. They're like, Yu-Gi-Oh why don't you go through and see if you learn more or less about what's going on other than cards after you do it. And lo and behold, they probably did it for four or five catalogs in a row. Very arduous, very tedious, not fun. But you know what? I made it fun when I'm like, oh my God, this sold for this. And then I started to recognize, like, wait a minute, this might be a deal. And so I learned so much just through my own hard work. But to be clear, amazing mentors in my corner. I love that maybe like the expectations for cards in that era, I would imagine just like the sale, attention grabbing headlines probably, you know, maybe a, a couple of times, a few times a year as opposed to now where they're like almost daily. It feels like. Do you feel in a way that your career path, like you are kind of been riding the wave in the come up of sports cards and collectibles and like, do you think of like, this is something that I've kind of been a part of on the ground Fleer and I just, I feel like I one-of-one it to myself to continue to ride this way for as long as possible. Like, do you have that sort of mindset since you've been working professionally in this space when cards were sure they were popular, but nowhere near to where the heights of where they are today? Well, it's an interesting way you put it. I don't necessarily know that I feel I one-of-one it to myself. I feel very grateful. I mean, without exaggeration, Brett, we could be talking today about a podcast about how I became the number one paperclip seller in the country. And you know, you could be someone who was in charge of office supplies and you found paperclips to be really interesting for whatever crazy reason or not. And I know that I would not be as excited even if I was amazing at buying and selling paperclips. Brett, I do not think I'd have that same passion. And so I really feel is that although I've been very fortunate to ride the coattails as this industry has exploded. I feel very grateful and candidly lucky because I really love what I do. But just because you love what you do, that doesn't mean you get to earn a fair living at it. Right? There's plenty of people that never take their passion and they're able to earn any money from it. And so there was a little bit, of course, of the right time and the right place, also creating your own luck and working hard, that contributed a lot. And to be clear, taking a lot of chances. I mean, you know, I left Leland's to start a company, which I didn't know at the time would turn 20 years old this year. I left a really good job. They paid me really well. I was the director of acquisitions. When I left there in my 20s, you know, I was very proud. But I also knew I had more to do and more to experience and more life to live. We think about, like, a lot of the content we see today. And there are people, you know, at card shows, you know, spending a lot of money selling cards, buying cards, and there's this, like, viewpoint on the buy, sell, trade through the proliferation of content that we get fed in our algorithm. I don't think, like, a lot gets discussed and talked about about just, like, the buying process and someone who's building a business around, you know, cards and collectibles, like, the buy is everything. I would imagine it's the identification of opportunity, the understanding of the materials, the price point and striking and buying. I would imagine, through your experience at Leland's and going through the catalogs and putting the price, like, you probably that started to get your Mosaic memory going on, like, what things are valued, like what. Where there's deals, that sort of thing. Maybe, like, share some perspective on just like, the skill set and the elements that. That you bring kind of to the table when you're thinking about buying inventory. When someone, like, calls, just collect and they say, like, I have a collection. It's got some Willie Mays, some Jackie's, some Babe Ruth's, like, I want you to come take a look at it. I'm sure there's some sort of skills that you've kind of built over time to just look at something and understand, like, where there's opportunity. Maybe talk a little bit about just, like, how you view, like, buying. Sure. Great set of questions, Brett. I'll try to do the best I can to answer one of the things I would say that I did early, meaning when I first left Leland's. And I was just scrambling. I was doing some consignment. I was buying and selling. I mean, Brett, if I could buy a lot out of an auction or an estate sale, I'm making it up. If I could pay a thousand and I could sell it for 1,800, I didn't even care how much work it took. I'm like, oh, I think there's a possible profit there. Of course, I've now learned our time is really valuable. Who's on our team that can help us and so forth. And so I've come a long way in terms of just starting there, recognizing an opportunity for what it is, versus, I'll give a perfect example. And maybe this will help some of your listeners out there, even if they don't do this full time. But they're someone like you who is aspiring to do it, let's say more like, of the buying and selling. But they don't exactly know what to do. Not every deal has to be for you. And I know that might be hard, but if there's someone locally in your town and says they have a basement full of stuff, let's start there. You're like, Yu-Gi-Oh you know, you can kind of feel your. You're. You're getting a little excited, right? Your fingertips. You're getting like, maybe. Maybe there's a deal here. Meaning, you know, I can identify what they have. I can pay them fairly. I could break it up and I could sell it for a profit. So where I like to start, Brett, is I ask people, what are some of your favorite items in your collection? Or you're more valuable. And if you get an answer like this, oh, I have a Joe DiMaggio, such and such. I have a Cy Young, blah, blah, blah. That sounds really cool. Tell me more. Versus I have so much stuff, I don't even know where to begin. Well, let me help you. Just name one or two items, and then you kind of look at them and you can see the steam coming out of their head because they don't really know. And that's okay, Brett. But what's not okay is to just run and jump and go across town and go into someone's basement just because they have stuff for sale. And so I've learned not just for myself, but to help my team to pre qualify people to the best of our ability. And that goes a long way in terms of us being more efficient as we decide what collections we either might investigate or we just may not go any further. Does that make sense? It does. What I hear from that is the importance, and I think about this all the time in my role. I just think about the importance of asking questions. And when you ask the right questions, you discover information. And it is interesting. And I've always found this, and I'd love to get your perspective as someone who interacts with a lot of different Topps of people over a long period of time in the. The industry, it feels like it always stands out to me when I. The smartest people or the most successful people that I've meet in this space are the ones who are always the most curious and ask the right questions. It. Right. It gives them information, it saves them time. It. It cuts to the chase, and they're able to build a stronger connection with the other subject or whatever they're trying to do. So, I don't know, like, do you think that curiosity that you. You have and that kind of paired with the passion has made you a better buyer and business builder over the 20 years you've been in business? Yu-Gi-Oh So shout out to my friend Chris Hoj from, you know, Car ladder fame and Michael Jordan Zebra collector. You know, he said it to me several times over the last couple of years because, Leighton, you're a very curious individual, and I am, but about what I'm interested in. And so it's never been a problem for me to read an auction catalog from COVID to cover or want to read a really long thread on net 54 about something as innocuous as, wait, there's a new rare back in T206. This can't be true. Right? And so that kind of stuff, to me is enjoyable, but I also understand it is making me better at what I do. And as I sit here, Brett, and I know, as I ask my own questions on a podcast, and I know what makes a good podcast, I. Or so I think I believe it probably. What. It's what also makes me really good at my job, talking to people. Because when I'm talking to people about their collections, they're not just hearing me say to them, how much stuff do you have? And how much is it worth? Because if it was really that cut and dry in black and white, I don't think I'd be as successful. I'm like, wait a minute, you started a 32 US caramel set you didn't finish, you'll do in a tick. You know what I mean? And this is how I talk to people. But I'm still finding out information, Brett. And I'm finding out that they're not going to sell me their partially completed 32 US caramel, but they know I'm interested if they ever do. Yu-Gi-Oh I think we get like, in this space there's a lot of Tunnel Vision and it's like a lot of me, me, me. Like a lot of people trying to pursue collections for themselves, like get the best deal, like try to shortcuts and building businesses. But then like, it's the curious people that to me are always prevail and always, like, are playing the long game and always kind of one-of-one more down the road. Do you find that, that curiosity that, you know, Chris said you have and I, I would agree. You know, I've listened to you enough on your own podcast and Jeremy show that you ask a lot of questions. Do you find that to be a kind of a differentiator in this space with. Against maybe other people doing similar adjacent things as you? I didn't think about it in such black and white terms before right now, if I'm being candid, but I always say this. It's like the bagel store experiment, right? If you go into the bagel store and you're wearing a smile and you ask for extra napkins or extra jelly, they're going to be bringing it to your table. Like, sit down. I gotcha. Meanwhile, if you go up there and you're a dick and you act very righteous and you're owed more napkins and you're owed this jelly, you're going to get a different type of attitude. And so even though I didn't really understand, I was quite doing it so consciously. I absolutely believe it helps our business because people know I am genuinely and generally interested in not just what they have, but, but how did they get it? How did their journey come to be as it stands today, and how did they get here after, you know, the last 37 years? Give me a story that stands out to you. It could be your banner moment as a business builder. Like when someone asks you the question, like, what is the most memorable buy? But like, what is a time where you approach someone and through your discovery and questions, like, you are presented with a some cards, some memorabilia, something that stood out and was so significant to you that you could hardly believe you had the opportunity to acquire it? Sure, I think what comes to mind, I forgot what we called it, but it might have been called like, you know, Arizona, the Desert Heat collection. But I bought Almost a thousand 30s Gowdy cards several years ago in Arizona. And I walk into the home and I can send you some of These images so that if you want to edit them in, it'll make. They'll make good, you know, for people to see. And Brett, it was so. I don't know how else to say it, obnoxious that I say to the folks. I'm like, where's the Babe Ruth cards? So we go to the Babe Ruth area. Brett, there was 18 raw Babe Ruth cards just stacked raw. Nothing's graded. And the way it's all organized, I'm like, do you guys have candid camera here? Like, what the F is actually going on? And long story short, they left me up front to my own devices to appraise this for, like, hours to the point of, like, I felt like I was being watched. And maybe, to be fair, I was, you know, rightfully so. Stuff's worth a lot. So I get all my notes together, I'm feeling really good, and I'm thinking, this is going to be an easy peasy deal to buy, because they have it all laid out. They're thrilled to see me. I've come from the other side of the country. And all of a sudden he starts in with, well, you know, Sonny, I saw ruth sell for $37,000. I'm like, oh, shit, that's not good, because this roof's not worth $37,000, right? And I mean, literally, I feel like for that deal where I was in the beginning to where they knocked me down at some point, like, I'm like, oh, if I leave here with a bottle of water and. And nothing else, Brett, I'll be very grateful because I literally had to re. Explain to them the whole process, the whole industry, and I wish we were taking video at the time. Was I nervous? Of course I was, because basically they could have just sent me home completely empty handed, and it would have been well within their rights to do so. But I was able to very calmly explain to them what they had to take all the time that they had in the world, you know, to research it. And if I had to come back, I would. I don't normally say that, but for this kind of gouty collection, I was willing to. And then, as you can imagine, almost like the way I'm describing it, there's like two of the big brothers. Are there, like, very burly type figures. There's a petite type woman. She's the sister. There might be a friend, and you can like, literally cut the tension in the air. Like, are they gonna sell me these cards? Are they gonna kick me out of my butt? You know, I don't know what's gonna happen. So fast forward, we reach a deal, which I'm so grateful to be able to do. And, you know, not all the time, but sometimes folks either want cash or they one-of-one wire. So we went together to the bank so I could wire them the money. But I'm not kidding, Brett. I'm holding this six figure collection in like a pink shoebox and everything's raw. I haven't even put in a card saver. So when we're done with the deal, I paid them and they're like, Yu-Gi-Oh it's great to meet Leighton. They're like, so which direction you going? I'm like, well, I'm going there. They're like, Yu-Gi-Oh we're going that way. So, you know, call an Uber. Really wish you luck, peace and love. It was very nice meeting you. And I'm like, oh. And so I was very happy then, but I was that much more happy when I securely got back to my hotel and I could celebrate in my room. I'm like, are you serious? I'm holding no more than like a 40 cent shoebox on the streets of Arizona. I'm disguising it as obviously not to be something special. I look like I just one-of-one the lottery. And of course, I'm trying to act straight face when I get to the hotel. Like, la dee da la. Hey, Mr. Sheldon, welcome back. I'm like, I go to the room. So I go to the room and like, literally I spread the cards out on the bed and I was very happy. And, you know, there wasn't the biggest deal I ever bought, and certainly not the best. But I have such a great recollection of the visual nature of seeing, literally, in an L shaped fashion, almost a thousand Gaudi cards spread out. It was visually stunning. Physically was like almost overwhelming. And, you know, listen, let's be honest, right? If everything was just so easy in life, it wouldn't be as fun. So I think that because part of me knew that there was no guarantee with was like, I stayed in this highly acute state of awareness and made sure that I did every single possible thing I could to give ourselves the best chance to get that collection. And I'm glad we did. What a story. A few things stand out to me. And I think one thing that we're so used to seeing in these moments where the pressure cooker is turned up is that the individual uses tactics to try to, whether they're buying or selling, to get the person to move now and move as quickly as possible and use words that Say like it's now or never, that sort of thing. But like it sounds like in this opportunity like you kind of took a step back, came from a place of abundance and the individuals or the crew there that kind of helped you get to the next stage. And I think this is with buying and selling. Like there's stages in all of this and a lot of through those stages you're trying to build rapport, you're trying to build trust. Like, is that something like you coming from a place of abundance, is that something that you've just naturally always had when you're deal making? Or is this something that has come from just like a lot of deals over a long period of time? I'd love to tell you I had it from day one, but I think it's just got better over time. And you can see that even though I'm a 20 year veteran, plus being I've been doing this for much longer, my company formerly turns 20 years old this year. Just collect that. I operate not just my business, but I operate my life in abundance, right? Whether it be it's with my family, whether it be it's with friends or dating or anything and everything in between. So I do feel very fortunate that when people come to me, I'm no longer just buying physical goods, I'm becoming the caretaker for their story. And I don't want to sound all, you know, holistic and holier than thou because I'm certainly not. But I am a good storyteller and I enjoy thoroughly producing videos, albeit, you know, as my son will say, I'm a B YouTube star. He understands that I'm doing it out of the love for sharing the story. And to be fair, in some cases someone's lost or a family's lost a loved one, it really is an amazing way for them to not only of course financially help their family, but then I can tell you, I call it the tie goes to the runner rule in baseball. This is a little secret in the industry, but if you make people feel good about doing business with you, they're going to choose you time and time again over the same people that may give you the same amount of money, but they don't show any, you know, I guess, self awareness or emotion or any genuine or general interest in your story or who you are, where you come from. That is a good nugget and Goldin agree more. So much of this industry has moved online. We're behind logos and avatars, we're messaging like it's harder to get to know people and build and develop that trust. You do a lot of business, you know, online, but in person, too. I'm curious. Like, you sound like you're a guy who, you know, isn't transactional, right? Like, you're looking. You might get a deal, buy a collection or buy some cards or buy some memorabilia. But you're probably thinking, like, there might be more here if I'm able to manage and nurture this relationship. Like, how do you think about the not being transactional and being someone who's building relationships? And those relationships are things that can, you know, if you pour some water on it, over time, you can get more opportunities. Like, how do you think about that? Just across, like, all of the deals, all of the people you're interacting with on a regular basis? Sure. Great question, Brett. And I would say first is with sincerity and genuine, genuinely being interested in someone. So if someone's working on a set or what they're collecting, it may not be anything that I can ever help them with, but especially if I don't know anything about it. Kind of what I was alluding to earlier about being curious, I do like learning about other parts of the hobby that I don't know about even. I think those might be records behind you. And I collect records because I love music. I don't know that I'll ever get into grading records, but I'm going to have a conversation with my buddy Jim, who owns an awesome record shop, about grading records. Maybe I'll never grade a record, but I'm interested in learning about why people are grading records and what records are they going to be grading. And these are some of my favorite records of all time. Meaning it's. It's the genuine interest in what I'm doing. And the dollars either come a little bit later, maybe at the same time, but I don't lead with that. And I would also say that on the flip side, it is important, Brett, that when you're dealing with folks that they know you're an expert. So I don't necessarily tout who I am and what I do. I just do what I do. And if someone has a question, I'm smart enough to not just, you know, keep talking and be a buzzsaw, I'll pause and say, you know, hey, does this make sense? Or I know this is another tip I would offer folks I know, as you were alluding to some pressures that other people put on people selling them things. I've had a lot of people say, you know, if I decide in the End to maybe cake. Take one or two of these items back. Like, will you penalize me? And I say, well, what do you mean by penalize? Like, put you in the penalty box. They're like, no. Will you not buy my deal? And I said, no. That's why I have a spreadsheet. If I take off two items, if it's something that's really near and dear to my heart, I might tell you or ask you, would you consider selling me one of them? But I'm not going to be one of those people who stomps on the counter and says, nope, if you don't give me this, the whole deal's off. Meaning, I just try to be real with them, Brett. And I try to be down to earth. And I find it gets me really far. I want to spend a moment talking about content. Just you have been someone who's been public, whether your own podcast, trading card therapy, Jeremy show, just other outlets, being a voice for vintage, vintage cards and collectibles. When I think of people who collect vintage, like, there are, you know, a few people that stand out in my mind. I think about you just based on all the content I've consumed from conversations you've had over the years. Like, how important has content been to the growth of Just Collect brand, Leighton Shelton's brand, personal brand, like, all those things. Like, how important has just being regular in content been for you? Vital. It's been vital. You know, I can elaborate as much as you like, but I know I could talk. What's happened, surely just by mistake, is in the beginning, I really was just doing it because I like telling the stories and I like sharing. And I was hoping maybe, just maybe if one in a hundred, one in a thousand people like it, maybe they're going to hit me back and say, you know, I'd like to buy that item. Or, you know what, one day late and when I have something to sell, I might reach out to you. Awesome. That was really my intention. Certainly didn't envision where it would take me today. And I would share with others out there that if you can produce content, and this is something that someone said to me recently, I didn't realize I was even doing it. But if you produce content for the sake of producing content, it will be very obvious. If you have real value to offer folks and you're producing content, it's actually going to be very obvious to people that you should be producing more content. That's how good it is. And I'm not suggesting that my content's Amazing. That's not what I'm saying. But I know the value of what I'm bringing people. I have people regularly tell me through messaging in conventions, a person, Leighton, I really liked your appearance and such. And such. I wish you would do more of X. You know, if you only heard it once in a while, you'd say, Yu-Gi-Oh that's a really nice compliment. But I don't really know if that's actually true. When you start to hear it and it's reinforced, Brett, that's how you know it's working for you. That is the truth. You are a busy guy. There's a lot going on. You know, there's shows, there's content, there's software, there's buying consignment. There's just. There's a million lines to kind of the work that you're sinking your teeth in on a day to day basis. Like, when you wake up and you go to work, like, I'm sure there's no typical day, but, like, what does it look like? Like, how do you organize yourself around everything that you're doing from, like a services perspective? The first thing I do candidly is I look at my calendar and I know what my responsibility, my responsibilities are as a father. So, you know, I have my son half the time, and so if I have my son on that day, I know I one-of-one be able to work as late, and I know that my day will stop a little bit earlier. I might even have to take my son or participate with my son as an assistant baseball coach or his tennis lesson. So I'm sure you could imagine, right. That day has a different feeling to me than a day where I could maybe work till midnight if I need it. Right? And as a fellow father, I know you can appreciate this. I just want to keep it real. But on a day where I don't have cross and the whole landscape is wide open, I could tell you it's probably just a matter of minutes, certainly less than an hour, where even though I have my day plan like this, all of a sudden I'll get a call. But an exciting one. Usually exciting from the office. Leighton, did you see the lead that just came in? I'm like, no, I'm still brushing my teeth. Or Leighton, that guy got back to me from yesterday. Do you know what Leighton I'm talking about? Nope. Could you tell me what's going on? I'm really excited to hear about it. And so what happens is you have this. Call it run of the mill or regular activities that you have to take care of. But then if you have a deal or a collection come in. I don't mean physically come in. It could just be the information comes in. But then I have to talk with someone or I need to look at data or I need to look at information. And it just goes for. It's actually why we could do the podcast tomorrow. Cause I have to go to town, so you never know is the point. But I like it like that. I really do. Where do you think in today's market, with your experience, where do you find that you have maybe an edge or an advantage in what you do? Like, I'm sure you're constantly evaluating the landscape, evaluating what things are selling, what people are buying. Obviously, you've got, you know, auction wire, where you can see these items across platforms. Like, where do you think today, just based on your experience in this market, that's probably going to look completely different in the next month because that's. Those are the cycles we're on right now. Like, where do you lean into your advantage? An advantage you might have. Sure. So I think, to start with, I'm very good at understanding what someone has and what it's worth. And I'm also not afraid to tell them most other people. I found, if we're being candid here, Brett, my edge, and I'm probably letting a little bit of the cat out of the bag. I've seen. I cannot believe how many dealers on deals of sometimes even six figures. I will pay you $131,000. Sounds very impressive. What if those items are worth $331,000, Brett? Would you feel as good? Probably not, right? So what I've identified is a process that I've taught my team, that you try to build trust. In a way, you're being authentic. You're letting people know what they have. And you never start with, I want, I want, I want. It's. Yu-Gi-Oh that's great. That's something that we might be interested in. But before we even talk about that, did you ever think about what it might be worth? And of course, the more commoditized an item is, right. I don't have to have this whole back and forth. Oh, you have a graded group of mantles. Leighton, I've heard of your company. Can you do me a favor? I'd like you to tell me if you're interested. Yes, we're interested. When you get a moment, could you let me know what you would pay for these? So then what I do very well, I think with my Team Brett is we set expectations. So we tell people, if we give them five days or two days, we explain to them that we're not only going to make you an offer, but we're going to do better than that. We're going to tell you what we think it's worth, and we're going to give you a consultation that we're not going to charge you anything for. But make no mistake, if you have a thousand graded cards, we one-of-one value all thousand graded cards. We're going to value 20 graded cards because we want to see if we're on the same page. So I talk to people and not at them. And I think that it works really, really well. And I always leave room for people to be inquisitive, have questions, be unsure, ask questions about the data. And that's another thing that I preach here. If you have a data point, you have a value. It's okay to be wrong. It's not okay to BS people and not have where you think that information has come from and why you think it's worth what it's worth. It's okay to differ in opinion. It's not okay to make up the information. Good, candid feedback and appreciate you sharing that. You have been building. You've been working in this space for a long time. You've been building your business, you said, for the last 20 years. You've seen a lot of things change. You've seen a lot of people come and go. There are a lot of people listening to this who work in the industry or aspire to work in the industry. I'm curious, like, what are those traits that you've identified that others who have staying power, who have been able to remain doing what they're doing for the long haul, what do you think you observe that those individuals have? Like, I think about COVID the last time the boom happened, there are a lot of people there, but then a lot of people left right away after prices went down. I'm curious just in all these cycles, like, what are some of those key traits that you observe about other professionals doing this that kind of gives them staying power? Sure. Great question, Brad. I think that the first one is being genuinely curious, wanting to learn more, not just about what you might be trying to buy or sell, but about the process, about what's going on with the platform, what's going on across the space with education, with podcasts, meaning actually caring about the space you're operating in. I think that's a big edge. Make no mistake, everyone has Access to card, ladder or other type pricing, you know, services. So I feel as though communication is another thing that is really important. And I can tell you just based on the ebay messages I get, probably many others listening can appreciate this. We will always write to people. Hi, Tony, thanks for reaching out. Unfortunately, we can't sell for that. We can do this. And the response is three letters or two words. And so I just believe that you get out of life what you give, not just in our business, but in life. Right. So kind of like that bagel shop analogy I was talking about earlier. So I think that you can generally identify someone who's a sharp in the space because of their personality and how bubbly they are and how interested. But make no mistake, there are probably plenty of people who can make money in this space. They don't care so much about collecting and they don't care so much necessarily about what the hobbies that look like in 10 or 20 years, per your point. Will they be here in the next cycle? Only time will tell. You've been doing this for a while. Do you wake up and go to work with kind of these. What has changed over the years? Like, is it. Do you still have the same hunger desire? Are you still trying to figure out new problems to tackle, new opportunities to identify? Like, that's a long cycle of running your own business and it's, it's admirable and it's not easy to do. Like, what has changed the most maybe for you over that run? Like how you looked at it when you started to kind of how you look at it today. Sure. So I wrote down two T's, team and tech. So technology has advanced wildly. And once again, I don't want to make this to be an infomercial for auction wire, but I would encourage you folks, there really is not another tool in the hobby that if you are simply looking to discover something new or if you're a Jackie Robinson collector and you want to know, like my buddy Tony from Southern collector, the next time a signed Jackie becomes for sale, whether it be in an auction house or like your friends from ebay were sponsoring this, it could be at auction or at fixed price. It's a really amazing tool for discovery. And so that is something that I'm very proud of. And getting back to the two T's, I believe that the only reason why I was able to see Auction wire to what it is today and hopefully well beyond is not just because of Mark and Ryan and our dev team, but also because I'm A hobbyist at heart. I love what I do, but I also want it to be done as efficiently as possible, even if I don't do it for a living, as I've described it to people. Let's just say you had tons of money in your house. Steinbrenner from the Yankees. You think he wants to be on platforms for an extra three hours? If he doesn't need to be, he would love it. To deliver the unopened stuff he's interested in really succinctly and efficiently. And then as far as team, I would tell you, when I first started, Brett was really, really hard to trust in my team. Can they do an evaluation? Will they talk to a client properly? But, you know, I have a few people who've been with me for almost 20 years, so shout out to John and Robert. But I have other people who've been with me for many years as well. And so I know for me as. As an owner, an operator, and as someone who's an aspiring entrepreneur in the space, if I didn't have good people, I'd be very limited to how high I could go. I don't just mean financially. I just mean in whatever goals I'm trying to accomplish. Sure, that's a good perspective. You've shared a lot of wisdom and insights in this time. Maybe. Leighton, as we close this out, I'm curious, what sort of advice would you have based on your experience for any individual out there who is just getting up and running, working full time in the sports card industry, whether that's for themselves or for their plugging into a company, like, based on what you've learned, like, what's one key piece of advice you'd share with them? Try to keep that fire and passion alive. It's going to carry you really far, well, well beyond your wildest dreams. And don't let a bump in the road or that proverbial downslope of the rollercoaster deter you from continuing to move forward. Because make no mistake, it's not gonna all be smooth sailing. But if you love it, if you're passionate about it and you really love the space, you're gonna treat it well. And I think it will treat you well also. This was an Absolute Pulsar Leighton Sheldon Auction Wire. Just collect. Really appreciate the chat. Looking forward to doing this again down the road. Absolutely. Brad, I'd love to have you on my podcast as well. I love what you're doing, and you're bringing such a wonderful perspective to folks out there that may be trying to get involved in the hobby, but didn't realize that there's all these different angles and ways that they can do that. So kudos to you. Thanks a lot, Leighton. Great conversation. It was my first time syncing up with Leighton and really enjoyed his story, his wealth of knowledge, his insight, everything he brought to the table. That's what we do here on Passionate Profession. We share insights from individuals building awesome businesses or working inside of awesome businesses here in the sports card industry. Shout out Leighton. Shout out ebay for supporting this series and shout out you for coming out each week to tune in. We'll be back with another one next week. Until then, take care. Happy collecting. Talk to you soon.