Alexis Ohanian Turned Collecting into Buying a Card Company

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And when it's go time, your 11.3-inch diagonal touchscreen's got the playbook, the playlist, and the tech to stay a step. It's more than an suv. It's your Equinox Chevrolet. Together, let's drive. Yes. So what? I've got money already. I'm not doing this to 10x the revenue. I'm doing this to keep the community. I actually think that's an awesome approach. Not approach, but it's a needed thing in the space as well because it goes back to the principle of, hey, we were kids collecting in a binder. All right, we are here. We've been here for a while. We did an early recording, a big guest. Shut the music off. It's early. It's now 10 o' clock and we're coming back with some intro music. Playing the hits here at Rock 101.3 Boston Station for your nostalgic rock songs. DJ Jesse the Perb. What was that? That was an accident. Hi, how are you? Good to see you. Doing great. We have Alex here now. We had an Alexis here earlier. Not Alex. Yeah, there's a lot of Alex in the office. Alex, clever Cuban is coming to pick up the card show stuff for the Nashville show this week. Yeah. Alex Tressler is here. Hello. Been sitting here for 40 minutes. First time in the office, right? Yes. Yeah. How's. How's life? Oh, life's been pretty interesting. How is the White House? Yeah, let's just go right into that. There you go. Well, before we get into it, this mic on. Oh, is it low? Is it not on here? Seems like it's a little nice. There we go. Now we're doing it sound like he was at the White House still talking to us. Cooking with gas. Yeah, sure. We just had Alexis here though. Alexis Ohaney. I did look Ohanian, excuse me. He does not like to be called Alex. That was one of the first things Chat GPT told me so like a pro, I asked him that and it confirmed. So Alexis Ohanian, as far as being a guest on here, I didn't know how he was going to do. But once I saw before this I did try to do a little research. I looked at a few of his interviews of the guy is smooth on camera like he. He is media trained. That last question, I meant what I said. Like I was actually interested. Anybody who knows me, you two know and anybody listening. I generally my thing is super short attention spanned egomaniac and I like to interrupt and I don't even do it to be. A lot of times though, I'm just like, I want to focus on one thing. Don't interrupt. Who are we talking about? I'm talking to you, sweetheart. But that question about entrepreneurship, you'll hear in a minute. It was one of the last questions. I actually was like, I looked, I was like, it's been like two minutes. He hasn't stopped talking and I haven't interrupted. That's how you know it's good. And then he brought it back. Well, but it was also interesting to listen to. I mean, some of you guys try to talk for two minutes. I'm ready to kill myself. Sure. Actually liked what he had to say. Very insightful. But to your point of media training, brought it back at the end. I was like, he totally. You know what? You know what? I do want that pest service at my house now. I didn't even know I needed it. Well, it was good. Steady. It's actually very good talking about it. Let's throw to it and play it first. All right. Yeah. So here is Alexis Ohanian. Our interview with him. Alexis Ohanian is our guest. Co founder of Reddit, founder of venture capital firm 776. Investor, entrepreneur, sports team owner and now take it easy. Owner of trading card company. On it. Alexis, how are you today? Good, thank you. I'm doing really well. I mean, I am missing the Knicks parade for this podcast, but other than that, dang, son. Big time. Let me let you in a secret. The dumb New Yorkers are just going to burn that city to the ground because they're not used to Winning stuff. Oh, put that shirt away. Isn't that nice? Isn't that. That beautiful? I hate it. I'll be honest. I'm a Boston guy. I actually, I told Jesse I like that team. I found myself rooting for the underdog, likable team. Yeah. I'm gonna say I like the fandom. I like the fandom. I love how passionate people are burning cars, like. Yeah, well, the degenerate stuff is. Is not okay. That's okay. That's the. The masochism that it takes to be a Knicks fan should be lauded. Y' all are spoiled up in Boston. You might be getting my buddy Yanni, if the rumors are true, I heard. I'm pumped. I hope so. Which would be massive. Massive. That'd be crazy. My train, big Celtics guy. And so he's always talking his talk, which is fine. It is what it is. But I actually. I have a fondness for Boston because I started Reddit there in Medford. Oh, dude, did you really? Well, you were on your. You were. You were on a train. You stopped in Connecticut when you got a call back from the. The venture capital firm Triple M. Didn't. Wasn't the idea. I think it was. It was ahead of its time, dude. It was ahead of its time. It's basically the Uber that is now. Right? I mean, it should have been a thing. That guy missed the boat. But I guess Reddit was. I guess successful. He. He was. He was right, though, because 2005, or might have even technically been 04 now is 05. You know, there's no smartphone yet. There was no iPhone, so it was going to. We were going to have people ordering food from text message. It would have been a cluster. Like, it was a good thing. We pivoted. But it was a genius idea for being town. It was good. It was ahead of his time. That's half. Half the problem with entrepreneurship is. And that's the biggest thing they have to try to plan around is like, you need the right founder. It always comes back at the end of the day, it's like the founder. And then the one thing that you can't control as a founder is timing. And it's the hardest thing to predict. But sometimes you get it right, sometimes you get wrong. Well, obviously, you've parlayed your expertise in company ownership, and now you're getting into the card world, which, here's the fun fact for those who don't know, you've been into cards for more than just this recent purchase. I remember DMing with you from our account two, three years ago about Serena Williams cards. You may or may not know. Do you. Have you heard of Serena Alexa? I don't know if you know, that is, but I'm a bit of a collector. Yes, I am married to her as well. And quietly, and then not so quietly built up what I'm certain now is the largest collection of her cards and whatnot for, for our kids. And hopefully that's a family heirloom. Who knows? They might, they might yolo it all and go to Vegas one day. That'll be up to them. But I just didn't want, I didn't want all those cards and match worn stuff. I didn't want all that stuff to end up in, you know, someone else's collection or a museum one day that they got to go pay money to see. And so it was a fun, fun hunt. I think I've got as much as I could 3. I think I've got three 2000 net pro, right? Pro PSA 10s. I think that's kind of what we, we had talked about on DMS for a little bit. You tried to, I think you were looking, you were saying you were collecting them. I knew if I could just hold out a little longer, I can really just rake this guy over the coals. It was gonna end up selling or. No, no, I still have them. I still have. I've realized, no, I can't let them go. So. Yeah, you got me. You got me right where, Right where I wanted you. Years later. Look, the nice thing is, you know, I've got to have. I don't know, I, I should look at the pop, but like probably 90%, that's crazy. least the most. I mean there's a bunch of random, you know, some of the common net pros, and I still have like hundreds of those that were already slabbed PSA tens that I just wanted to have. But. Okay, but outside of her, besides the wife, what do you collect? Yeah. Okay, well, so here's what's weird. I, you know, as a kid growing up in the 90s, like I had just binders and binders full of that junk wax era and thankfully my parents saved them. And so in probably just around pandemic or just before, a couple of friends of mine in the group chat were like, yo, cards are back. Like, are you collecting ba ba ba. And I dragged out a lot of my old cards from my dad and then I actually slabbed probably 100 of them and none of them valuable. Right? But just, just like memories and Things that I thought would be grails one day, but, you know, weren't. And then I went back and started collecting the cards. Like the. I can see the face card. Right? This is. Yeah. Billy Ripkin. Sure. Television. Yeah. Face card 89 Flair. There's. There's. I have a lot of oddities that were just things that I coveted as a child that I just wanted, like, even like a PSA 10 Griffey upper deck. Like. Like the. The. Not for investment, just for sort of, you know, this sort of deep joy and satisfaction. And then as the hobbies started peaking with the pandemic and everything else, I also started coveting again. This is all nostalgia for me. So I was a big. I got into drawing and actually into Marvel comics via the Marvel cards. Those impel cards. Oh, yeah. And. And like every kid of that era was collecting tons of them. I remember. I was really proud of my. I remember saving up money for the 9192 masterpiece, the first mobile masterpieces, and the Jesco art. And that's what I thought was sort of elite collecting back then, because even the concept of. I just wondered who were the people that could buy a whole box of these things and then open them. That to me was the heights of wealth. And so I started fulfilling all these childhood fantasies where I would just be buying boxes and cases of these Marvel series one through three, the masterpieces. All these cards that I just loved so much. And. And then I started chasing holograms. Because those cards were mass produced. Yes. But were so horribly centered. Yes. The holograms are. Those. Goes for a big premium still. Especially with decent grade. Yeah. Because the center was brutal. Yeah, the center was awful. But. But, like, I like, it was. So I've been going back and collecting. Either I was ripping a lot of them like a psychopath and my wife would be like. Like seeing me at the table just tearing these packs and again, just. Just maybe fulfilling. I don't know, filling some hole in my childhood heart who. Who, like, you know, wasn't going to be able to afford doing this. And it just was so delightful. And so I've been chasing. Building out every one of those sets. Right. And I think I've basically got. There's one. I don't know if anyone's listening. I think it's the. I think it's the Magneto. No, I think it's the Magneto hologram in a PSA 10. And I'm still chasing from that Marvel series one. But anyway, all from a 1, 2, 3 master. That first masterpiece is set. I've got, I've got all of them now. Slab PSA 10s. And again, it just, it just gives me joy. It, it fills some, some hole in my heart. And then very quickly, a buddy of mine was like, did you ever collect the, the PMGs? And I was like, no. And, and some of the art on some of the PMGs is like, not great. Like, there were a couple of years where I personally don't find the art very attractive. They're hideous. Classic. No, no, the, the first run, I think it was nine. Let me see, 2000. You're talking Marvel or the. Or for Sport? No, the Marvel pmg. No, I mean, I like I, the, the aura of the sport. Precious metal gem for sure. But again, as a, as a obsessed Marvel guy, one of my buddies, I think was Chris Shout Out. Chris was telling me about PMGs, and I just was already out. It was probably 12, 13, 2013 was the first one with a really good, really good esthetic. And so then I'm collecting all those and I'm getting the 15s. And so I've just. 17, I think, was where they strayed a little bit on the art front. But anyway, yeah, it's, it's weird like that. And, and it's basically. I, I, I've also been a hardcore Washington Commanders fan since I was a kid. And unfortunately, all my favorite players, those cards are from, like, the Junk Wax there. So, like, I've tried to buy every great Sean Taylor card I can. And they're nice, sure, but they're not, you know, beautiful. They're not stunning. Whereas, like, I, I put out a bid for the Jaden Daniel, Jaden Daniels, one of one, which I, I lost to Josh Harris, who, you know, is the owner of the team now. So I guess it ended up in a good place. But I, I don't chase too many of the modern cards that are sort of obvious for collectors. And now that I've gotten into women's sports and specifically starting all these teams, like, I'm also collecting my own players cards just because if I'm like, well, I'm excited about Alyssa Thompson playing for Angel City or Chelsea Women's, and I want to get her cards too. And so that's, that's what sort of led me down the road too. That eventually got me to. On it as a backer of the UVA women's basketball team. Like, seeing the opportunity in college sports specifically got. Got me really excited because I think there's a great gateway here for a bunch of people who are not hardcore collectors to just rip a pack and feel that feeling and, and collect some of their favorite players. I have to know, as far as, like, you being a collector and then getting into on it, what made you think, like, you know, with all the competition of Fanatics, being an owner of, you know, so many licenses, what made you think, like, oh, we can do another company and compete? Well, look, I know I. I know, Michael. I mean, I've spoken to Fanatics Fest. I feel like, I mean, Fanatics is a partner for, I think most of my teams and leagues. They've. They've done a lot to broaden the hobby and bring it to a much larger audience and do a lot of innovative stuff. I love the fact that college in particular is like just a very, very, very different beast, right? You're not talking about securing, you know, a FIFA deal or an NFL deal, NBA deal, which are highly lucrative and where, you know, incentives get aligned a little differently. Like the, the value proposition for college that was so exciting is that you could actually build a product that would be accessible to fans. And that's where on it is today. You could build a product on, let's say, the long tail. And what I mean by that is like, look, we have, we have what would arguably be a Mendoza rookie card already, and, you know, he obviously ended up becoming a great prospect. We'll see how he does in the league. But we also have the guys who block for him who, who may never get a card because they may never have a pro career. There's a very different mindset when you're working with athletic directors and doing this kind of licensing, when you can say, look, we want your star, but we're also going to take care of the guys who are watching as blindside. And also, obviously, on the women's sports front, I love the fact honest produce more cards like last year, in the last few years for women's college athletes than every other card company combined. And so I'm obviously a big believer in this. And then once I got under the hood, you look at something. I just got the LA franchise for League 1 volleyball, women's volleyball league, professional league here in the US and at the same time, I'm learning from the ONIT crew just how well the Nebraska women's volleyball cards sell relative to Nebraska men's football. And I'm sitting here like, wait, what? And with all the time I'm spending now in volleyball, you can see the fanaticism, you can see the fandom. I mean, that women's volleyball team, Nebraska is legendary. And, and the numbers show it. And so I think these are, these are cards, these are licenses that are just not appealing if your business model is. I want to create the most premier, elite sort of grandiose card business possible. It's a different mindset, It's a different model. And I think, I think it's great because we're growing the hobby in a very different way. Like, I, I fully. I already know on a. Cards are so many people's first step into collecting, and I want it to continue to be that. And then I also want to produce a product where, look, if we do have a Mendoza, if we do have a star who breaks out, who goes to the league, you know, like a big four league has that kind of a career that even jaded collectors are like, yeah, okay. Like I. This, this, this is a real rookie. This is a true rookie. And you know, it feels like it's boiling the ocean to try to be both things, but I think there's a way to thread that needle and, and create a product that's both affordable, but also has some elite drops that are really, really coveted and respected by the hobby and real quick when it comes to licensing. So are you doing. Is this like a school by school deal? Is it an individual nil deal? How does I. Because I don't know anything about it. It is, it is a little bit of everything. Certain schools and, and this is the other, I think, exciting thing. It's all in flux. Right. NIL has evolved a ton in just five years. Sure. That was a big part of my thesis a few years ago with women's sports and particularly when I was tweeting about women's basketball was as these NI deals, Nil deals started happening in college and women basketball players or women athletes started making, you know, over a million dollars a year from brands. You'd have this awkward conversation naturally occur in the professional leagues because if these individual women can generate that kind of brand dollars, and again, that's not charity, that's a brand saying, we think you're valuable, promote our product. If you can make that much money in college and, and you're only getting paid 60, 70,000 in the pros, it exposes how poorly run the pros were. And obviously you're seeing that shift now. I am excited because there are schools that are actively trying to build out this business themselves. There are other schools that are doing basically saying, hey, Company X, can you go sell these rights on our behalf? So it's a mix Everyone is figuring it out. We're obviously willing to talk about, you know, to everyone. Maybe not the hokies, I did go to uva after all. But anyone else other than Virginia Tech, perhaps we'll still, we'll still work with Virginia Tech. The, the deals, the nil deals that you're doing, is it. I, I don't know. In confused. I, I think when I think of nil deals I think of it almost like a stock that you're owning and it's like, okay, well I own this, the, the stock and this guy and we're, we're hoping he goes up in value and maybe one day it's like, oh, well, he goes to the pros or she goes to the pros. And it's like, well, we will, would sell this deal to maybe fanatics or another company. And we're, we're making money on cards. We're. Because it is a business at the end of the day. I get that we're all like about the, the promotion of them, but I, I also think like, oh, this is a real investment, not only in a company for you guys, like you guys are getting money from it, but it's an investment in their future too. Because if they go up, if they're viewed as like, oh, nil deal is much more valuable than it was when we first bought it, then all of a sudden they look much more appealing to the rest of the public because they just, you know, news comes out, oh, fanatics bought up their contract and now they're going to go over and do professional cards there or something like that. Look, it's not, I think as long as the athletes are winning, we're happy. You know, you could imagine, imagine you're a star. I don't know. Libero. There you go. Women's volleyball shout out. Yes. Imagine you're a star, Libero. You know, you're getting paid some amount of money for you know, an auto deal, some on card autos from us. And, and what's different, the on it model, you know, our goal is to get everyone on the team paid because everyone gets cards. And so part of the appeal for you. And again, and this, I think this is really even more compelling with like the hot shot, you know, NFL bound quarterback who like wants to take care of his guys. You know, these deals, the amount of money we're talking about here is like significant but it's not so significant that a quarterback wouldn't actually prefer that all of his guys, especially the guys protecting him, blocking them get, get a card too and get some money from that as well. And then there is another payoff which is a little bit more subconscious which is like part of the reason why it's important for us to still have these like valuable Chase cards is that those auction dollars in the secondary market do have a sort of implicit value that the athlete benefits from. Right. So if you are you know that star libero and your card ends up selling on alt which I'm an investor in or golden or ebay, any of those places, you know that creates a headline, that creates a tweet and that makes it a little bit easier for your manager or whoever's doing some brand deal for you to say like look at what my athlete is worth because even you know her card is selling for this five figure amount or six figure amount or one day seven figure amount. And so it's a weird proxy for the sort of assumed value or future value of an athlete. But you know I, for us I love knowing that so many of on its customers today like are they're, they're just buying on a cards because they just want to support their favorite university year in and year out and all those athletes year in and year out and then if we can earn the respect within the community where again these, these especially the chase cards and some of the top prospects are valuable that that will get the best of both and that yeah when look, if, if other folks want to give a good deal to individual athletes to go out on their own, God bless, that's their call. They can do that if they want to. But we think we'll have a really compelling proposition and there's nothing like focus. We can really, really make sure and credit to Evan rco we can really make sure to deliver a great product that speaks to the fan base, that speaks to the, the community. We've got some clever ideas for things we're going to roll out here in the next like six months and just excited for folks to see it. We're that that focus I think will will start to compound. Well I think the pricing will be nice too because that is like the one big thing and obviously you're investing a bunch of stuff in the card space. Like that is the one complaint and we break on the side as well. We flip singles, we do the whole thing and the content but that has become like an ongoing concern is like man, I'm just priced out of so many products. But it does sound like the price point of entry for people to go and get a pack A box, whatever, is going to be much, much cheaper than what's available now, by and large. Yeah. And I think, and I think that helps distinguish what we're building. And I want that to always be, I think a North Star for us should always be that access. There should always be a path in for someone to rip their first pack through us. And I, like I said, I think it's a different business strategy, but I think it's no less compelling in the long run. And especially given like, one of the things that I noticed spending time looking at like European, especially European sports clubs, especially like football or soccer, is there is a deep, deep, deep connection that really it made me rethink American sports fandom. And don't wrong. I love being an American professional sports fan. I think it is 15 years of me tailgating at Skins or Commander's games to, to prove it. But college sports is probably the closest thing that we have in the States to this otherworldly, just really, really deep, passionate fan base that you see in, in Europe and actually I guess many of us are seeing in the World cup now as folks are coming through here. And, and there's an energy to college sports that I think is just incredibly compelling. And I want to see these athletes benefit. And, and again, not just the stars, but every guy on that team and then especially not just the men, but also all the amazing women doing it too. I think the fact that you're going after that crowd because there are college products in the tops and fanatics and others have been putting out for a while, but it doesn't feel like they've gained the same kind of foothold as the professional sports have. And it is true, the college fandom is so much different. In my experience growing up in the south, it's like everybody would be a Tennessee Vols fan, especially for a long time. We didn't have the Titans growing up. And then it, it's still that way though today. It's like everybody, you know, Bama fans and your Florida Gator fans, and it's like they are huge fans. And then you start talking about NFL game and they're like, oh, I don't really watch NFL as much. And I'm like, oh, but you're such a big football fan. And so to go after a market that has such a passionate crowd that may not have been tapped as of yet, I think it's a really smart play. And you also. I've been seeing the cheerleading cards that you guys also have, which I. The fact that the DCC Dallas Cowboys cheerleader show is as popular. Don't be dropping it. No, I'm just saying because, well, the new season came out and my wife just had like a little watch party. Your wife had a watch party? My wife's daughter and my cousin. Yeah. I'd like to. I'd like to check tape on who was binging that show at your house. Back of the house. Just watching whatever they were doing. I don't know. Anyway, but it's a popular, it's a popular thing to have so much empowerment around women's athletics and to see that you guys are putting a focus on it is really cool. I think if we had just another minute. Can you explain the thought process about having Evan Parker come on? As far as the CEO of the company, he's obviously the mind behind mantle, who a lot of us in the hobby have seen doing other news content. But it's the award show. We got slighted on exactly that part. Yeah. So thank you. You know, still a little hurt, but it's okay. It was the people's will son Evan a death threat. We're fine. What, what was your, what was your thinking as far as like, bringing Evan on board? This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50 page restoration block. Or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it, ready to make anything online make sense. There's no place like Chrome. Check responses. Setup required. Compatibility and availability. Various 18. And we're live on Matchday as Doug reaches for a buffalo wing. He's got it. Oh, and he's got for a can of Pepsi too. What a finish. There's no doubt about it. It just tastes better. Match days deserve Pepsi. Well, so we've worked together now, as you said, for the last, I think three years building mantle. And so we're still, we have, we have big plans to keep doubling down around the hobby awards and some other stuff there. But I've gotten to see him up close and personal building that, executing on that. And when we were getting close on terms for the onit purchase, I was like, okay, well who, who are we going to slot in here who has a deep understanding of the hobby, who genuinely sincerely loves this stuff and also conveniently, he's a terp. So, you know, we're not, I guess, ostensibly rivals, but I mean, I grew up in the DMV So Maryland. The, the, you know, he, he has that spidey sense for collegiate sports and, and also, like I said, a deep collector himself and a great operator. And so I, I know it's in great hands with him. I'm still, I'm chairman. I'm going to be deeply involved as we build this out. I've, I've already publicly said, like, I want every athletic director in the country to feel like they can reach out because I want this to be multifaceted. We have, we have some very clever stuff that I think given the background, especially as a software guy, especially, you know, 15 years building Reddit and having a, I'm like a heat seeking missile for these deep, deep, deep community fan bases. And so, you know, as you were describing, growing up in the south, like college and college sports particular, has this very, very unique element to it that I think we can speak to in interesting ways and that we can get really fired up about this. Like it will I. In my mind's eye, we are successful because, you know, five years from now there are people saying that they got into collecting because of our product. And, and it's also not lost to me that I want a lot of those people to not be traditional collectors. Right? Not necessarily, you know, guys our age who, who all look like us. Like, I think the hobby does really, really well to grow in the next five years if it expands. Like, I, I've, I have two daughters, two black daughters. I have already started. I mean, we've tried with NWSL cards, we've tried with squishmallows cards. Like, I, I want to find ways to meet them where they are. Disney, Disney, Prince. I got Disney cards for them. There you go. And, and I just like the fact that this is a product again, because college sports just has such a different tone to it. It is a much more community driven fandom that I hope a bunch of young kids can get into this that never would have thought about or even older. I don't want to just not just the youth. But that is the best entry point. Right? And the reason we still love collecting, I think the way that we all do, is because we have some childhood memories, some core memory, and it's weird. My dad was not into cards, but he collected some weird stuff. Starting lineups. Sorry. Oh, okay. Hang on. First of all, first of all, not weird at all. We just took them down. Dude. Starting lineups are freaking awesome. Starting lineups. I literally just, I met a guy at a Waffle House parking lot a month ago. His name is Chris Cooper. He's a saint. Guy literally had the entire run of Griffeys from 1988 to 1998. Made my free. I bought $10,000 worth of cards. I was more happy about the 18 worth of figures. They are in the new studio. By the way. Your dad sounds like a saint. Nothing weird about that's cooler than me. I just, I, I like I actually should ask him if you thought that was going to be like a long term investment. Dude, we all thought those were going to be amazing. I know. And they. That is the one thing that's not come back from childhood, by the way. It's such bull crap. Every time you think like, oh well, this is not gonna make its comeback. I'm just gonna go ahead and get rid of it the next week it's like, oh, hang on now. I don't know, I don't know. I mean if you didn't get popular during the COVID bump, I'm not sure there's any hope for it, but. Well, patronize me with your Alexis. I do think it is awesome to see you entering this space especially because you have had a deep fandom into this. So yeah, if, if there's anything. Hey, real quick. I just have a couple quick because just super rapid fire. Only a minute. I mean obviously you're a crazy successful investor and have started Reddit and all these other things. Our audience doesn't get to hear from people who have been as successful and neither do me and Jesse as you Just a couple quick. Like, you know, just, I'm just interested like so somebody in the hobby now who's trying to make a business out of this. Any kind of principles or advice you could share for someone just trying to start out as an entrepreneur? Yes. So, okay, I here's. I think there's two sides to the hobby that are important to consider. So there's the speculative side which like I think I, I think of my life when I do investing, company building. I think of it like a barbell. And so much of what I do and where I spend my time is highly illiquid. Illiquid, right. It's. It's long term holds. It's starting a company and waiting 10 years before it's going to go public at least. And, and then very, very, very boring. Like index funds. Right. Because I want to live at the two edges of like T bills and index funds. And then incredibly risky, incredibly high reward but long hold illiquid. You can't buy a bottle of water with the stuff here for a decade, right. And living in that barbell. And so I think similarly, if you're going to be an entrepreneur in the hobby, there's that same balance of speculation where, you know, and look, folks are getting more and more sophisticated now that these AI tools are helping them. I've got friends who model out their, their trades now in ways that are far more sophisticated than I ever could have imagined. Like it's almost like their own little Bloomberg terminal. Right. And then there's another part of it which is the, like the steadily building of value. And I think, look, I like seeing this explosion of hobby shops. I think again, these are more entry points to get people into collecting. But I also can only imagine that it's a pretty taxing business and you've got breakers, you've got all these different parts of it. I would say however you choose to go down an entrepreneurial road, the barbell at least has served me well. Where you have something that you know is a steady, steady source of income, it's a steady thing. It's content, right. It's recurring revenue that you can basically control. And then there's a portion that is the, you know, the riskier part. And I think where you weight those two sides of the barbell is probably based on where you are in life. Right. If you're in your 20s, you don't have, you don't have kids. Yeah, risk it, go way more risky. Again, not investment advice but like generally speaking, yeah, take your shot, take your shot. And, and then obviously when you've got mouths to feed and stuff to do, you've got to adjust for that risk. But every one of these things comes in a cycle. We saw, I think, I think, you know, we, we saw the froth a few years ago during COVID and Stimmy checks. It cooled off, now we're back in another upcycle, it will cool off again. Like, like, like do not delude yourself into thinking that it won't. And 20 years from now, do I think this is still a valuable asset? Absolutely. But there will be cool cycles and so just be prepared. But I'm, I'm more bullish than ever about sports. And in particular one of the reasons is like two or three years ago, once ChatGPT dropped, I started yapping to people about how sports was going to be the only thing left in entertainment because the Hollywood would be reimagined thanks to AI. And when, you know, and so many movies are made with computer generated images and graphics like it was, you know, it was Very clear that business model is going to have to change. And music same way. I mean, live touring is the one exception, but like actually making beats and all this stuff is going to get changed drastically. But you could have had a pixel perfect AI generated version of, I don't know, that OG tippin and it would have done nothing for anyone, right? Because it was fake, because it didn't actually happen. And so sport is fundamentally human. And one of the things that will, five years from now, ten years from now, no matter how good technology gets, it will not be replaceable. And in fact, I think it becomes more valuable because everything we see is just, it's some version of AI slop, right? It's been programmed to be the perfect dopamine hit at the right time, give us what we want when we want it. And sport will feel even more valuable because it will be so human and it will disappoint us. Then it will make us happy when we finally see our team win. And so the assets around sport then I think also will continue to endure and be valuable. And I also, I'm a big nostalgia guy and I do think that there's a generation of us now who have this analog nostalgia who are trying to get our kids into it because so much of their life is digital. And then you're also seeing Gen Z weirdly nostalgic for a time they didn't even know. Like, there's a whole trend of gen zers fawning over the 90s. And I'm like, you literally don't even know what it was like. Yeah, you weren't even born. Yeah, you were barely alive, right? So it's not even, it can't be nostalgia technically, but there is a very interesting trend happening there. And I think as the world moves more digital, which it will, having a dead tree with a picture on it is, is I think, even more special. And that's not to say we wouldn't look at doing clever sort of smart digital stuff in the future. But like, I'm obsessed with this sort of anachronistic thing. Like I, I, I very, very, very bullish on people wanting to touch and feel and trade. And like, that's, that's another thing I hope could be a big win too. Like, I get, and look, I love chasing great, great cards. I love ripping packs at the same time, like, there is something really nice about the fact that we all had binders and binders and binders of cards, just trying to collect them all. And I worry that that culture is not the Same it. Like, I don't want to say it's gone, but it's, it's much more about chasing that one. Value has screwed up a lot of stuff these days for sure. Like now it's the dollar, the amount of money I feel like doesn't mess with that. Yeah. And I, and I wanna, we have a product that's already positioned in such a way that we can try to bring the energy back to like, yeah, fill up a binder, try to get every one of these cards like it's. And, and I'm excited to see that. I, I think, I think we have a shot here to build just a very unique product in a space where, I mean, for all intents and purposes, there's really only one company. No offense to Panini, but like, you know, there's, there's basically one very, very, very large player. And I think we have a space we, we can carve out that's just really unique and true to our vision for how the hobby can be. And, and actually to the credit, upper deck's done a good job talking about this. Absolutely. Building product around this too. So I should give them their flowers. And so we're just focused on college and what a pro. Answer I ask about entrepreneurship brings it right back to his product. In a casual way though, I didn't feel like he was knocking on my door like shove. And just came right around to it. Pretty good. He's where he is. He's done this. He doesn't know how to do this. On a train in Medford to telling me his plan for the college scene. I like it. We've come full circle. Well, actually it kind of works out too because I remember that conversation we had maybe a couple years ago with a. He was a investment analyst, equity, some kind of investment company. He was trying to find out is the card space like something that they could invest in. Do you remember that? Let's pretend I don't. Okay, well, I do remember. I remember this conversation very well. He reaches out to me last night on Reddit and he's like, hey, remember we talked like, here is. He sends me over this 36 page PDF. Delete. No, no, no. I mean, it's actually super interesting. It's basically all of the thoughts from retail to hobby to target to your LCs, like every detail of where you could invest, how the hobby is growing, what it looks like from a financial point of view. Could it be investable? It's like really detailed and interesting stuff. But I'm like, man, you See, stuff like this, you see Alexis before you. I don't want you to get away from that. Well, I'm not going away. I'm just saying, like you and then of course you. We saw like the cards HQ guys, they just got a big investor from a venture capital firm. It is by far something that is viewed as valuable because it. Wall street does not get involved if there's not going to be value at some point to be had. It's just we need more thinkers like this where it's like, okay, we need to have a product or something that is valuable to everyone, but it's still not going to blow up their wallet or break the bank for them to be able to enjoy it. And a product where they could get in for less than $100 in some cases. It's like, okay, well, yeah, that is actually feasible. And it still provides like that hit of dopamine that. So let me recap just real quick for the audience because they also missed this part of the discussion that was off camera on why you're a serial killer. Number one, you spent 16 hours ripping Disney Chrome. 16 hours on a live stream dressed like Buzz Lightyear, profusely sweating. True or false? Just true or false? True or false. That's true. Thank you. I was wearing the Winnie the Pooh outfit when I was sweating. Next, you admit to me and Alexis that you're just. You're shotgunning for the last week, freaking unflavored oatmeal again, serial killeristic. And now you're reading a 30 plus page thesis from some wacko Wall street guy who God knows what basement he's living in, but it's somebody's basement, not his house, by the way. And you're just, you're just reading that at will at night. That is your life. Then you come in here and sit and talk to our people. I just, I would just like to say, if anybody would. Alexis, thank you for coming. Hang out with me. I'll be at the park later. Yeah, you're gonna go hang out at a kids part? I didn't say kids part. Bring your dog. At least bring your daughter with you. Okay. So anyways, Alexis, they don't think you're just there hanging, like hunting. I'm not as weird as it sounds. I'm just very into this in the business side. And I like all. And I like Disney and I like. Just like he likes Marvel and everything else. It's cool. All right, great. And I, And I do, I do think you're. I think you're I think your instincts are right here that he's a killer. I think so too. Yeah, I think the police department would agree as well. He is doing such a fantastic job. Let him be the media trained gentleman that he is and change gears please. I, I think, I think you're interested instincts are right. I think, I think the, the challenge with capital, with money that's not looking for a long like I, I, one of the advantages to building with 776 is I, I'm the biggest LP in our fund. So basically I, I have put in more of my own money than we've taken from individual, from any other LP or investor. So, so what is nice about that is our mindset is not, oh God, we got to flip this thing into something. We got to make sure someone gets paid in a few years. We got it. Like we can have the longest view in the room. And I think that is a tremendous asset for any kind of business that you want to build, but especially one that is community oriented because we can make the best decision we can possible for our athletes, for our fans. And like not everyone who is investing into this space has that freedom to be able to do it and I think that ends up becoming an advantage. Well, Alexis, Alexis, real quick, just, just to your point there, just interrupt for a second. Like the fact you didn't sit here and talk anything about revenue or like, hey, the top 10 quarterback, you're sitting here talking about, I mean, and I'm not saying this to be negative, but like there's a volleyball thing. Me and Jesse never heard of this. Volleyball. The woman playing volleyball speakers. Volleyball. But that's what I'm saying. That's fantastic. I've never heard about it. You're sitting here talking to me about that with passion. You're talking about getting linemen paid. I can tell you right now, linemen are never going to take over the hobby. And I almost get the attitude with you, which I like is like, yes, so what? I've got money already. I'm not doing this to 10x the revenue. I'm doing this to keep the community. I actually think that's an awesome approach. Not approach, but it's a needed thing in the space as well because it goes back to the principle of, hey, we were kids collecting in a binder worth nothing and wasting our time. But it was awesome. Correct? Because it was awesome to us. Yeah. Which, I mean, it was perfect. Like, I wouldn't trade that for flipping a Brady autograph for TEDx. But I think that is A cool that there's a different voice, a different reasoning behind one of the companies in the space. I think, I think it's awesome. Like there's room for both. So I think it's very cool. Yeah, I appreciate that, guys. And I. And I do think it also will let us innovate in some really interesting ways because we are leaner. We there. I think there's gonna be some really fun stuff we can do that'll hopefully also inspire maybe the other folks in the space, which, you know, that's fine. Yeah. Good competition. We want to. We want to grow this thing out a serial killer cards. Next. Wayne Gacy. You. You seem know a lot about serial killers. Oh, that's an assassin. The assassins have three names. Jesse Rhodes Gibson. Actually, you say. You say that, Alexis, but his sister in law, my cousin, has a nice collection of serial killer cards. I don't know where she got them. What? Really? My wife does. No, I said your sister in law. My cousin. You have my sister. Oh, Autumn. Well, dang it, dude, I'm trying not to just out. Okay. Yeah. But yeah, serial killer cards she has. Exactly. She runs my finances. I'm learning a lot about family. Autumn is a potential killer in charge of my bank account. Yeah. You get my kid if I die. And God knows the crap you're into. He's already into Pokemon. We've already. We're getting right into Disney. Hey, Alexis, this has been. Yeah. Thank you so much for the time lightning and for a lot of us. Yeah. And I appreciate it. Mike appreciates it. A ringing endorsement from Jesse the Killer Gibson. What a treat for. On it. Oh, put that right on the. Right on the main page. Right on the mask page. We'll put it on the. Yeah, yeah. I'll be coming over later tonight just to see how everything's going with the business and anyways, no, thank you. Even creeps love our cards. There you go. Best of luck to on it. You and Evan and everybody else on board. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Mike and Jesse. This is great. And we're back. Man, that flew by. I know, right? It's always faster than you think. It's behind the fourth curtain. It's a lot faster than sitting on the couch watching it. Yeah. He sat there for 40 minutes like a. Like a jabroni. Hearing you guys. I know. That's the worst part. You hear us. You're like, oh, that was great. He's like, I didn't hear a thing. What was great about it was thinking about that. And we forgot to Close the curtain. I had to look at him. I know. I was like, I think this is bad, but I don't want to be. Stand up and be rude now, so. Yeah. Thank you for just being patient. How is. You are a traveler these days? I feel like I see you everywhere. Yes. What is the deal? Can I just be honest with you? Is it. Was it as insane in person to be at a UFC event at the White House as it sounds, like just saying it out loud? Yes. It. It's just. It's more the environment. Right. You know, I talked to everybody about it. You know, since it's happened, you take that card. That card was incredible. Yeah. Fight card, not a baseball card. Jesse. I actually did not know that. I saw the look of. I was like, there's a card I'm supposed to know about here. Welcome. Now I get it. Okay. The fight card was. You know, the lineup was incredible. All of them were knockouts. If you take that card and just go to another venue, like, it's just another UFC event. That was an incredible fight. Yeah. You have the backdrop of the White House there. Yeah. With the. The lawn behind and almost 100,000 people sitting there watching it. Was Trump actually out there? No, he's sitting ringside with Dana White. Yeah. I could also just see Trump in, like, from a window, just shining a laser pointer down there. Like, I don't know. Like, I could see a lot of different scenarios, so I wasn't sure. Yeah, he was. He was front row. His whole family was right behind him. There's Kevin, Cabinet members that were behind him. What was security like to get in this place? Like. Like, Secret Service level. You went across the street because we. They had us in a VIP reception at the W beforehand. We went through a security checkpoint that had. The army was out there. Okay. And then. Did you tell them my name is army22? Did you let them know? I made sure they knew, and they. They just saluted and went on. They're like, stolen valor situation. Yeah. This is not real. For once, it actually is real. Like, right. He's like, I'm here with baseball cards like that. I mean, I had UFC cards with me. See, I knew it. And then we went through the second checkpoint was with. Actually, because our tickets were on Ticketmaster. Okay. Literally. So we had to do the normal scan. That's what I was gonna ask. How did you get. Did. Is this, like, a SCN HSI thing? They paid for tickets. You were literally like, four or five rows. It looked like. I got news. You know, how you know, it wasn't. Wasn't SCN H. S I. He was sitting in the front. Yeah. He wasn't stopped at the gate. Yeah. It was five rows up from none of the seats. You didn't have to pay for anything. So one of the things about the. The White House grounds is you can't charge for anything on. At the White House. Wow. Okay. Restrict who comes or limit the. So how did you get this specific invite? He's trying to tell you. I know. I'm leaving. Hey, Mike, shut up for a minute. Leading into it. Yeah, go back to the security aspect. Let me finish that question first. Yeah. There was about three levels of security before you went to the metal detectors where the Secret Service was, and then you're just walking on the property over to it. Dang. There were snipers everywhere. Yeah, I mean, you know, spotlights walking around, people walking the grounds, People embedded in the actual. I figured, because if you get the president sitting there, like, you gotta. Okay. You were able to walk all around there except for the one location where the president was. Because everyone. We had. We had two different background checks prior to. Oh, wow. There's a whole bunch of stuff that happened prior to. So everyone. That was. So. They lost Jesse, by the way, before they got there. So it was incredible. So the way that I got my tickets, I got two invites. I got myself, and a plus one, which was my brother. I brought my brother with me. Oh, cool. He wrestled his whole life. Growing up, I was his wrestling dummy. I played basketball while he wrestled. So I was just like, there's no better person than to bring this than that. So I put a video out there. The power of the Internet, power of social media. Just saying, hey, 22 years in the Army. It actually is the Army's birthday that was on. Just happened to be. Oh, the president's birthday, too. Flag Day, and the whole nine yards. I was just like, I want to go. This is a sporting event. You know, one of the things I. I told myself after I retired is just like, I'm. I'm going to do as much as I can. Because I was restricted in the Army. I want to do as much as I can if I have the ability. And I was just like, I want to be there. Yeah. Like, I'll do what I want. So I tagged everyone in the world, right? You know, not everyone world, but everyone that had access to it. Dana White, the president, you know, potus, actual account, Michael Rubin, everybody. And about a week prior, I got a message from the ufc individuals saying, hey, you have two invites. Dang. So, okay, here, fill out this information stuff. Because the persons that saw a person and everything else. I believe it was actually Michael Rubin reached out to someone. Oh, wow, nice. And because he saw. He saw me tagging him over and over, I couldn't get invited to the Fanatics Fest games. This guy's sitting next to Trump in the White House. Interesting. I was in that last year, too. They wanted someone that saw the performance. I am very curious then after the. The fight and everything, are you just free to walk around to do like you were doing content and stuff? Like. Like, there's really no limitation there. So they didn't really tell us the only thing. I mean, they. There was. There was no guideline saying, hey, you can't. Because there was. There was places where you can buy. You can get alcohol and everything else. People were just drinking constantly. But in between the matches, there was plenty of time in between. So that's when I was just walking around and seeing, hey, who do I run into over here? Oh, I ran into Triple H, ran into Roman Reigns, you know, sat there and talked to them for like five minutes. Two other guys I'd slap around. As previously I mentioned. Oh, my God, you were gonna. Gonna get beat one of these days, dude. That is the talk about content. Triple H walks up and recognize me and punch me in the face. That's a win. It would be good. Content. Granted, you'd hurt his hand, but best part about it was, you know, you know, starting off, a lot of them saw my pin that I was wearing with, you know, my retirement pin. And thank you for our service. And all these individuals really appreciate the military. That's cool. So, you know, I got to sit there for like five minutes talking to Roman Reigns. Oh, this was his first UFC event. Event he's ever been to. What? Really? Yeah. So him. The excitement of it. And I'm like, you can't like, top this anymore. Yeah. I tell you who I saw you talking to, by the way. It's one of the bussing with the. Is it Taylor Lewand? Yes. So this was actually pretty funny. Arena Club, big sponsors of the show and network. I saw he walked up. I don't know. I don't know. Let me just tell you what I saw. Let me get the whole story. He's sitting there. Taylor's like, yeah, we're rip a Pokemon car with our buddy Alex here. He's ripping on Courtyard and the look on. And Alex like, yeah, he's like, have you heard of this? And Alex like, like, yeah, yeah, it was pretty funny actually doing this. How did that come about, though? I'm not trying to plug for Courtyard, but it was pretty cute. So in between I was walking around, I was actually being brought over to meet the Secretary of War. You know, just a quick introduction and. Secretary of War? That's a real thing. I don't know. Used to be the Secretary of Defense. Now, oh, that's just called War. I mean, hey, straight into the point. That's his actual title. We are useless politically. We don't know anything about. I didn't know that was a real thing. Does that not sound made up? The secretary. Is that in the Mandalorian? The Secretary of War. There's also, like, a Space Force thing going on now. So it's like, because we have a Force in space. I understand. I know, but it's just, like, much more. That doesn't sound made up to you. I know it. Okay, that's fine. Jesse's on your team. No problem. Quick, quickly. You know, was it Netflix made fun of Space Force by making a show with Steve. Tim Allen. Yeah. Yeah. Yes, that's Steve Carell. It was a Tim Allen one back in the day. Home Improvement. No, that's right. Now you got it. That's it. You're thinking of Galaxy Quest, and it's a fantastic movie. Okay. Anyway, so you're. You're. Yeah. So that is Taylor. Yeah, it was. I was walking over that way, and then I saw him in the corner of my eye, and I just went up to him. I was just like. Because he opens a lot of Pokemon packs right now. Yeah, that's one of his main things. He buys a national Ray loves. He's gonna. He's gonna be here. He's gonna be in. Ray's been trying to get him to come on the hobby podcast for a while. He keeps messaging him. Yeah, he loves Taylor. So I. I stopped and I quickly said, hey, you got any Pokemon packs to open? And then he just rip, rip right to court. He's just like, well, let me show you. Yeah. And which I was just like. So afterwards, I was telling him, like, yeah, kind of do stuff with Arena Club. So, yeah, now you have to be on one of my Arena Club. Now, Taylor, let me show you a better app. I'm gonna meet him. That. That's who I'm gonna go do the best. Are you doing that this weekend with him? No, no, no. But I should stop him and. Oh, yeah, do Arena Club, you know, during the National Park. Me on the spot. I'LL put your spot, buddy. It's really crazy because that video got a lot of views. Oh, I'm sure it's. Oh, massive. Following it well. And I was looking at. I've literally been watching while you've been talking, I've been watching your video of the Arena Club post from the. The UFC event. Did you get other content that's coming as well that we'll be putting out? So there's a few other stuff that's on there already. Okay. Handed out some. I hand out some packs of UFC chrome to some service members and stuff. And I didn't know the first person I walked up to. There's a group of Marines there. One of the Marines has like 1.2 million followers. What? Like, I forget what his name was, whatever. And I tagged him in. David Goggins is his name. And. And then I went up and I asked him every time that I went around, you know, the soldiers and stuff, they were just, you know, bombarding all. There's so many of them that really already know about, you know, cards and everything. Oh, already into the hobby. Well, like they've got it in the. Not commissary, is it? Commissary? Yeah, the PX that the guys going and buying stuff. Because I've seen several people. Hang on, what's the p. What are you talking about? So it's like a Walmart for. That's on post. It's literally on a base like a store. Okay. And they'll post up on sports cards. Nonsense and non sports cards on. Since I've seen different posts of guys hitting big stuff from packs that they bought from the. I'm pretty sure. I think I posted one on there too. Did you really? Yeah, because I go. I go in there every other day when I go to the food court, you know, for lunch or whatever, just to see if they have. And you got to think like there's no tax on base. Oh, yeah, that's like the most fun I know. Yeah. Like, hey, can you be our inside. I'm the secretary of this podcast. Can I go there? Just recently I haven't posted the video yet, but one of the. The fan. I wrote a little song to remind you. Choice hotels get you more of the experiences you value. The Cambria Hotel's got it all. A rooftop bar. Have a bar, bring a date, you squat or even your mom work direct@ChoiceHotels.com. are all batteries the same? That's like asking if all soccer players are the same. Take Messi, the most decorated player Ever. Is there any other player who has achieved that? No, just him. Now take Duracell. Is there any other battery with power boost ingredients inside? No, just Durace cell. Remember, goats only trust goats because they're built different. And Messi only trusts Duracell. Nobody help him. Nobody help. Yeah, machines that you can, you know, buy. Oh, fan stand. The fan stand. Oh, yeah, yeah. They're local. There's one in our PX now. So for. Is it Fort Campbell on here? Is that where you're going or. No, no, Fort Le is where I'm at in Virginia. Yeah, he's. Oh, yeah, yeah. That's taking you around here? That's right. You don't want to drive nine hours every day? Nah, sounds okay. So as someone who's been doing, you know, content, going around to different places, what is this life like for you at this point? Like, are you cool with the. The travel, getting comfortable with talking to people? Or have you always been like that? So when I first joined the military, I wasn't. Yeah, like, it was always one of those. My brother was always the one that was the talkative and everything else. Wanted to be the center of attention and I was the one that. That really was just. Just stayed in the back, did my work, whatever, and just did my thing. And it was the same way when I went into basic training and everything. But it just broke me out of my shell. Once I became, you know, higher ranking inside the mill, inside the army and stuff, I just had to be out forefront. I had to be in front of the soldiers, you know, and it just, it just flipped. Yeah, it's a mindset of like, I mean, what did they tell me? No, I don't care. Yeah, yeah, right. I'm gonna be in the same boat. Right. I guess I asked for something, you know, then, then I was before the. What's the worst case scenario here? Like, you've been in situations probably where there's a lot of danger, physical danger, and then it's like, worst case scenario is they could be mean to me or tell me to leave. It's like, I don't care at this point. I faced actual physical danger to my life and now I'm like, oh, someone says no. It feels like you would be more brazen, be able to go and insert yourself into more situations that other people would be afraid to do. Yeah, well, that's pretty cool. What is. Do you have things coming on next? I mean, like what. What's the plans going forward? What's the plan this weekend too? This weekend? Nashville. Nashville card show. What? That's why I'm here in Nashville all weekend. Mike's gonna be there. The whole crew is gonna be there. Eddie's coming out. He's flying out. Yeah, so I heard. I told Eddie I want to break with him while he's here. Dude. Saturday night, chef's shop here. Yep. Chef's cards start at 7 o'. Clock. Come by, it's open house. So at this point. Point you go to the show. Yeah. What? Yeah. What is the. But what is the plan for the show? Like, what's the content? Yeah, yeah. So, you know, Jeff, you know, who runs the show, is bringing me in to pretty much feature the show. That's what I do. Like, I come in to help, help, you know, promoters and stuff feature their show. Oh, cool. Come in. And you know, because he doesn't, he doesn't do. If you look at their, their Instagram page, you don't have a lot of content on. Oh, they don't do marketing at all. Yeah. So still unbelievable. They don't need to. That's what's unbelievable. Yeah, it's well insane forever. He's always said word of mouth. That's how he goes. It is, yeah. But, you know, he has other individuals that, that work with him. That one are military or prior military. And that's how I got incorporated with the last show in February. Oh, cool. And he just loved everything that I did, you know, showcase, you know, going to the sponsors and talking to them, you know, everything and pretty much just showing what the show is about for all those individuals that should possibly, if you're within a couple hours that you know, and you're just like, I don't want to make that drive. You need to make this drive. It's the best show nobody's heard of. And it's not true, obviously, it's an exaggeration, but it is. Like people hear about Dallas or Chantilly's near you. Like, I would say more people abroad have heard of those shows. Sure. Was the last one you came to, the first one you were here. Yep. How does that. Because again, you go to these things all the time. To me, I think it is the best show for actual transacting in the country. It is. I was, I was told, and I saw it firsthand, like the, the vendor to vendor dealing and everything that's on that, that, that first day for, for loading and everything, which is today is some of the best in the country. Yep. Yeah. And I mean, there's people that are getting their, their tables Bought out before the show starts. And they don't even literally been there the rest of the week. Yeah. Inventory and show's gone. That's crazy. Wow. And the fact one of the, one of the big things that's, you know, that's. It's not, it's not. There's nothing wrong with it. But a lot of these shows that are sports and TCG that have everything are. They'll say they're everything. Yeah. But then they're 75 TCG and 25 sports. Absolutely. That's not. This show. Especially now that. Well, now that he's started the other show, it's helped to alleviate Pokefest. But he still has that huge section in the back, which that whole back room now is going to full tables. Yeah. The weirdos was going to put them in the back. Yeah. It's called the Outcast room. So I don't know if they're just gonna. I don't. Don't know if they're just gonna do. Do. Because where the trade night normally is, it's going to be all tables now. Oh, the third pavilion. Yeah. So are they doing a trade? They must be. They're not. They're not doing trade night this week. This. This show. Good. I actually have no problem with that. If you're gonna just sell an extra 400 tables because. Right, yeah, they're selling. Yeah, they got another 400 tables. So I. Beautiful. I don't know if it's more sports back there or if it's going to be just all TCG back there. Yeah, yeah. So that would be something like I'll put out right away. Like, you know, today when I go there and everything, I'll make a video saying, hey, you know, this is what the layout. Look at this. Tables on tables, on tables. And then back here there's even more tables. Yeah. So, you know, given that information, I think it's great that you do this because not only are you a sport card collector and I don't want to out you here, but you buy into my non sport breaks as well. So the fact that you are into both worlds, you can speak more confidently about all of it. What are you seeing as far as like going to these shows? Do you see something thriving more than another or something not doing as well? Pokemon's having a moment. Like that's. That's actually, I'm. I'm starting to wonder if it's starting to slow just a little bit. I don't know. It's wild to see in the TCG side The Pokemon side, the amount of transactions of just the raw for like $3, $4 type of cards. Yep. Right. And, and we know in the sports world that your showcase has all the. Usually the bigger cards. Of course. Right. The bigger price cards. There's so many Pokemon dealers that just have rows and rows of three, two. Yes. They're all just on display. Smart. Well, you saw me last time, dude, when I we had the table. Did you come down at all last time or. No, I remember that was when I wore the buzz outfit, I think. No, no, he was, he wasn't here. Remember? Because I talked about coming on the puzzle. Yeah. Oh, that was the one before. Okay. Yeah, dude. But like last time I had just bought that 50k collection. It was almost awesome. My table was all just one to five dollar cards I sold. Yeah. It was unbelievable, dude. It was awesome. Well, you think about like what that's the baseline for collectors. Great. Yeah. Like how much if there's somebody there who has like some cash in their pocket, like they're going to be able to just. I, I always say, I always say like the amount of individuals that come to a card show, they're middle class individuals, they don't want to spend their whole paycheck on a card. That's right. So. So the buffer zone of $1 to about, I would say 150 to 200 super inclusive is the perfect, perfect numbers. That's right. And then there's the 3% of the people in the room that will pay thousand dollars plus for cards and everything. Absolutely. I am, I'm curious then. What do you like, what's your collection look like? What do you go after it? It's very unique. Of course. I, Pat Tillman is my biggest, my biggest PC, you know, and he only has a certain amount of cards until now because you know that I know it's a sports person, not a non sport person. So so far that's about the. Was a big Pokemon guy though, though. Pat Tillman. Give us more details here. Give us please let us know who Pat was. Mike's curious and I just want for Mike's sake explain this. Football player for the, the Cardinals. Cardinals, Right. And then decided instead of staying after 9, 11 happened, he decided to join the army. Oh, that's right. That's how I knew. Yeah. And pretty savage safety, by the way. Dude would freaking take people's heads off. I mean it sounds like a pretty incredible person. Just to go from like, oh, I've got a cushy life to I'm going To make my life a little bit more difficult. Yeah, but so he. He doesn't have that many cards. He's gonna about to. He's about to have more because tops already put him into the finest product this year, so. Oh, he was in finest football. He was. He was only a rare card. Okay. Okay. He only had a rare. That's cool. The super fractor was pulled like a week ago, I believe. I was just like, well, I can stop getting the Cardinals. But I mean, the refractors of that card go for $50 on eBay. Right. Right now. Are you serious? I mean, he's got a crazy market. Yeah, his market's nuts. But because they've always kept him limited. It's limited because. Because there's a reason. So to use his nil, you have to pay to his foundation. Oh, interesting. That's why he's maintained the value. So from what I was told from Panini was that they just didn't want to pay it. Sure. Which actually is good. It turned out to be a blessing instead of flooding the market with this stuff. So he never had a kaboom, which is. Thanks. Thank. Thank God. So I didn't have to get that. But he did have a Manga in Panini Black this past year. Yeah. Okay. So did he have one downtown or. No, he only had one. Okay. Which. He had a Don Russ and then he had to Optic. That was the first year Optic actually had the 101 gold vinyl. Okay. So you're a big. Pat Tillman. Anybody else for sports? It's very niche because I actually grew up and played baseball with him. 2010, Toby Stoner, he actually played for the Mets, so he had a lot of rookie stuff from that year. Okay. I probably have. Without a doubt, I have the biggest collection because in finest that year in baseball, they actually had Letterman's and they had a whole booklet of sir of the rookies. That's right. And that. So it was the 101 was the booklet. And they signed every single one. Yeah. So does he have one? He does. I have it. Oh, dang. That's a big Stoner fan over here. See that? I. So when. When he still talked to him, by the way? Oh yeah, all the time. I saw him, you know, last time I was up and back home. Oh, very. And just imagine if he got hurt and that he had, you know, had to quit baseball and stuff is if he was still on the Mets, how those. Those jerseys, Stoner jerseys would have been. You telling me that wouldn't have been. Guys played guys played three games of his life out selling Otani 10 to 1. Eddie's got 14 of them. April 20 comes around every year. And that jersey sells off everywhere. Your paraphernalia. I'm just saying he. He had a. A Bowman Chrome. It didn't have first on it. It was just a prospect. But in 2007, Bowman Chrome, the only one I don't have from that rainbow is a super. It's never shown up. Oh, wow. And then I have pretty much everything else of his now. What about non sport? Just. Yeah. Talk about the pervert. I know it's coming as someone who just did 16 hours of Disney Chrome yesterday and I. I just want to know. Fully ingratiated in the creep world. By the way, Friday I am doing the last five cases. There are terrible. Semi filled. I have the best pricing on the app. Come over if I don't. I'll try and match. So there you go. So. And I'm a big Marvel guy. So one of my favorite characters is Cyclops. So I have a few like. Yes. Semi rainbow. James Marsden as the original Cyclops from the. Well, original from these movies. Yes. So I have everything except up for the 101 in the Genesis line. So I just thought when that product came out, they was. They were just beautiful. Yeah. The tops. Genesis one. Yeah, that's really. You ever noticed James Marsden and all the rom coms he does is always the guy who gets left or like the guy forgotten. I hate. And even. And even an X Men, he gets like blown up by the lake by Jean Gray. Well, he never finishes his girl. I mean, that's what I'm saying. Speaking of him, did you watch that show Jury Duty? Dude, that is. Oh, the fake. Yeah. That's a genius. I did. Hannah turned me onto that. Yeah, very good. That show Paradise. That guy ended up being great, by the way. The actual Mars. No, he was like legitimate, like the nicest guy. Yes. And then they just had the next. Yeah. Oh, they did it again. It's a different scenario. What is it on what, Amazon Prime? Yeah. I think if you guys want an interesting reality show where the person doesn't know it's a reality show. Check that out. All right. So you're after some Marvel stuff. That's funny because when we were talking to Alex, he was talking all about his collection. Thank you. Thank you. I also have a semi rainbow of angel and chrome. I think it was last year. Oh, yeah. Because just the art that was on that Chrome card with his wings. Wings coming out. Angel Martinez Prospects of the garden. Angel is an X Men. It's on hell, by the way. Okay, well, now, what'd you. Marvel has already previewed or Thompson's previewed the Marvel product coming out. I think it looks better. The art for some of them at least looks better than last year. I think it's their best one yet. So you'll be happy about that, I think. Okay, cool. Well, hey, are you doing the Arena Club thing, by the way, at the show? Oh, yeah. We were talking about this. Arena Club is a sponsor of the show. Are you doing, like, the free giveaway or something? Yeah, so I'll be. I haven't truly figured out what I'm gonna be doing yet or whatever, but I do have a couple patch starts today. Giveaway. What code do you use? Discount code? No, he has free codes. Oh, marketing codes, homie. Do you tell people, like, hey, use this code because I have my own. I do my own with club, but then also the SCN code. I think last time you got. I actually want you to. If you can. If you have an SCN free one, I'll get it. I'll get some. You should do that free thing again. Because they went up and they were like, hey, the first person who has the app, they get the card. Actually. That was pretty cool. That is a good idea. Yep. Oh, I kind of want to do that company because I also at the same. So the last one, me and Alex. Clever little Alex. Little Alex here in a minute. Yeah, we did the downtown pack battle. Oh, that's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we'll be there. You guys should do something like that. But I did, like, the thing, like, hey, first person who has it. What is surprising how many people had it actually. What, did we do a pack rip competition last time? Yeah, I lost 86 bucks. Yeah, I kind of want to do it again. I'm good. You don't want to go again? I'm good. Thanks, man. I'm thinking about just ripping one just for fun. I get like, I. I am a degenerate in a lot of ways because I had, like, I ripped Saturday night, by the way. Did you really? I'm not sad. No, no. What day did we do that? Monday. Tuesday night, I had to show you half case of. Of Disney Chrome Blasters and a half case of Megas as well. And while, like, we're in between cases filling, I just start pulling them out. I'm just like, I. I just need to rip something because I want to pull something good. I've been like, I'm pulling something good for these other people. Now I gotta find something. Well, I, when I, when I'm going to my showcase, especially after I open the packs and everything and, and sitting there and I'm like, oh, the offer is close to what the value is. I'll research it and everything. Oh yeah. Make sure it's good. If it's close to. I'm taking the offer and guess what I'm doing. I'm re rolling it. Oh, I'm re rolling into some other packs. And like, like you said the other night I rerolled, you know, a couple things into. I, I kid you not, had to have been 20 packs. But I was jumping around different price points and everything else. All of a sudden I hit a. If I would hit a chaser. Next thing I'm like, oh, I got more money. I'm bumping up now and everything. Just trying, you know. That was the one I ended up keeping because I did the keep and release a few times. 2000. I ripped 5, not 6. I'm sorry. The fifth one though was 2004. Flare Tradition. One of my favorite sets. 04 was an awesome year anyways is it's the triple rookie. Philip Rivers, Eli Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, PSA 9. That one I kept because I just think it's a crazy undervalued card. I'm just gonna throw this out there for all the people who do go into those magical packs on Arena Club. If you let me throw this out there. Don't. It's called, it's called magical. That's, that's how you know. But if you get one and you get a Disney 100 card, do yourself a favor, don't sell it. I would actually not sell that one back. I would keep it because it's going nowhere but up. I, I got a PSA 10 out of 299 of a character Asha back. I don't know, a few months ago. I think it was like a hundred dollar pack. I, they valued it at 100. That could sound like three to 500. I had, I had that. So some of the stuff that I did for Arena Club and they wanted me to open some Pokemon packs because they saw that I did everything and a few of those cards sat inside my showcase for, for a while. Yeah. Yeah. And I finally had a whole bunch of them come in and like you saying, it was about a hundred dollar card when I originally ripped it and it was about 400 to 500 a card when I ended up selling it. Absolutely. Yeah. No I'm literally about to buy one myself. There you go. For the show. I'm just buying it. By the time we're off air. Yeah. So we'll be at the national card show this weekend. Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Friday night we'll have the big ebay live night with attaboy cards like we talked about. Chris was on the other day. Saturday we're gonna do a big thing on Fanax Live doing a bunch of breaks. We'll have New Topps Inception Baseball, Topps Dynasty. Me and Eddie are doing a dual 20k case battle and we've got like a couple thousand bucks to give away to the winning side. That'll be at Shep's Cards and Collectibles here in Hendersonville. And then Sunday night will be my big ebay live show at the Maze rookie in that insane Mantle collection. So we're gonna do the maze exactly at the 1952 maze at exactly 7:00'. Clock. But from the start of the show at 6:30, every eight minutes we're gonna do a Mantle game use patch. Every 20 minutes we're gonna do a giveaway. Why every eight minutes? Because I have. That's how many I have to fit in a two and a half hour period. Oh, okay, okay. Because math. Jesse. Well, I was told. Have you been in touch with Funko at all? He says he's going. Oh, he's supposed to ship me that DiMaggio. Yeah, the DiMaggio ball. I don't have it. I'm gonna be honest with it. We shouldn't do it now. It doesn't have way. Yeah, it's going to be tough to do it now. There's no lead up time for it. I mean it's. I'll do whatever he wants. I mean it just. I'm doing it Sunday night today. No, you don't have to. It's. I don't think you want you. Well actually, I don't know. Maybe I'm leaving Monday for vacation. Where are you going? Florida. I'm taking my mom. Yeah, for a week. Oh, that's what. Okay, well we're going to court with dad Monday, then we're leaving Tuesday. We may or may not throw all the details in. So when you say you have a giveaway every eight minutes, right? No, no, mantle every eight minutes. Give her every 20 minutes. Mantle every eight minutes. Do you have someone that that's doing that for you or are you keeping track of it so people in the room if you're there, you'll be helping with this. I'm gonna have literally have Tim, Eddie, a couple of the guys with their timers. Like hey, you have the mantle timer every eight minutes. I'll start the auction every 20. Yeah, for sure. And then we'll do some live trivia. Cuz I got the big whiteboard. Whiteboard. That's why we're moving the furniture. We're taking the furniture to the new studio. So we have a bunch of people in there. Since I am going to open this pack, should we just do it on air? Cuz do that then do the Harry's reading. Let's get out of here. It's 10:30. Oh, I don't have the Harry's read. Don't want to put on the screen slouch. Turn it down. Too terrible. Get some better music. Can you not play Springsteen when you're opening the packs? I think the licensing on that would be pretty expensive. Okay, well, talk to Bruce. Talk to Bruce. You don't like this music? How much did you pay? Whoa. You got a Buzz. Oh, oh, oh. It's a wow. But still. 2025 facsimile auto PSA 10. What did you pay for this pack? 100. What's a buyback offer? You're above. You're above that? That, yes. Just a little 108. But according to you, you're keeping actually. Well, this is not tops. This is the Kakawa one. And it's not 2023, it's 2025. So you're selling but I might still keep it. Actually that's actually. You deliberate over Buzz Lightyear. All right. There you go. All right. Harry's still. You have three shut. You have three bearded men here. So we can all talk about Harry's. Harry's razor. Still working with the show. We still have our affiliate code with Harry's. Make sure you use them. Harry's.com nonsense. The best razors. I still use it for my edging. I'm not shaving my face anymore because still I'm a little double chin. This is the only part I have to worry about and I haven't. I would be worried about more than that. But yeah. You look terrible. Use your Harry's on your face. You look like a mess. You get the travel kit. You get the two ounce container, the disposable blades. It's great. It's cheap. It's awesome. It's the best. I had to shave for 22 years in the army. So what did you use to shave 22 years ago? Were you using Harry's back? I did I did. Little Alex is now knocking and yeah, now we have another Alex joining the show. Come on in. Alex, by the way, clean shaven, doesn't even use Harry. She just has a baby face. Well, he doesn't. He. There you go, have a baby face. You have to use Harry's. So that's how you do it. Well, there you have it. All right, Alex. And clever keeping cards. Alex Tressler, Alexis Ohanian. Thank you all to Alex's in the world. We appreciate you. We'll be back on Monday, normal show. You'll be here. Maybe we've got. Yeah. Court in the middle of the day, so we'll see. Well in the morning. But I'm not sure how quick those proceedings happen. Okay. All right. Maybe I'll bring Papa Gio with us if he's still a free man. Alex, just be prepared, be on deck. Might have to come in back here on Monday. All right, see you. Iceland. Oh, hey, what's the northernmost capital in the world? Country capital Reykjavik. Goodbye.