My Cards Are Worth More Than Yours | The Hangover Ep. 5

The hangover. Man, that's got to be the best tune in all of hobby content. Joe Perot, what do you think, buddy? How are you? Oh, I'm doing well. Yeah. It gives you that feeling of riding in a convertible in the desert, just kind of rolling around to some. Some good tunes after a crazy night the night before. Maybe you are typically hungover. Welcome, everybody, to the Hangover. This is episode five. My name is Jeremy Lee. That is Joe Perot. It is June 23rd. We're dropping this. June 24th, on Wednesday. This is the Hangover. We had a great episode of Sports Cards Live this past Saturday night. David Novak was our special guest. We had Chris McGill. We had Josh Adams, Joe Perot, and David Chase dropped in from his Hawaiian vacation. Joe, that was a pretty fun episode. You weren't on the whole time. You're on the first half and back at the end for a little bit. Fun episode. These sel episodes have gone from three hours to four hours now. Four weeks in a row. Kind of crazy. It's. It's later and later. What do you think, man? I mean, should we continue that? Do you think it's going to continue? Is there. Is there just that much to talk about? Like, I don't even know why it's happening. Any thoughts? Oh, I think it's just a tidal wave of. Of people enjoying the. The hobby and hobby discussions, the dialogue, the discourse. Once it gets rolling, you know, you evoke some things in the first half of the show, and then the cleanup crew comes in with Josh Adams and. And Christopher McGill, and, you know, we. We hold court. So, yeah, I really enjoyed that. I enjoyed, you know, the dichotomy between sort of the investor thoughts and the artistic collector thoughts that allowed us to kind of dial in and get, you know, pretty, pretty inside the psychology on both areas of, you know, collector sensibilities. Yeah, getting in the minds of the art collector versus the stock investor and what similarities and differences there are in those two areas versus what we do with sports cards. Collecting cards, investing in cards. It was fun. It was a pretty deep. Pretty much a deep dive and took us through to the. The end of the show. We talked also about investing in cards. As a millennial, we talked about investing in cards whether or not you can do it and you guys can go back and watch that episode. It. It was. It was a ton of fun. The Pareto principle came up again. Talked about football cards, whether or not they're as popular as other sports cards to collect. It was. It was a fun episode. Had A great time. The next night, which was Sunday night, I. I did a deal, or I guess I did this deal. No, I did this deal on Friday where I bought a bunch of cards from my vintage memorabilia pusher. His name is is Tim. And I met him at the west coast card show in February. I bought. Some of you guys will maybe recall or if you've been watching sports cards live, have seen me show off and talk about the first lot of vintage memorabilia cards I bought from him, which was a brand new lane for me at that time, Joe. But it's a lane I'm still, still in. And even since buying those off him in February, I bought a few more cards just, you know, one at a time here and there on various marketplaces. And then our buddy Greg at Midlife, a fellow sports card clubhouse partner contributor, let me know that Tim, who's in his area in the Sacramento area, had restocked. And so I reached out to Tim and we made an appointment to chat on third on Friday. We did. We. We made a deal. And, and I picked up 13 more cards from him that I'll actually be picking up from him in person at the National. So the deal's done, the virtual handshake is in place, and I've got 13 new cards coming. And then on Sunday, just a couple nights ago. Oh, sorry. Back on Thursday, I should say on the Slab Sharks weekly auctions. I bought three cards there, so I'm happy and I'm gonna show you guys what I picked up because the hangover, you know, what we've had. We had such a crazy night last night. Let's talk about some cards that we, that we recently picked up, Joe. You got a couple cards also that you want to show and tell. So what do you think? Why don't, why don't we get into that? We also have a topic we're going to talk about after that, guys. But what do you want to do, Joe, you want to show you one of yours first? You want me to show my big 13 card acquisition? What are you thinking? Why don't I show two of mine and then I'll save the other two for after you show yours? Because there's a little bit of like silver sibling cousin connection between a couple of the ones that I pulled out. Sounds good. Let's. Let's see. Let's see a card. So this is just a basic mail day. It's a curry contenders orange and sorry, my light's a little bit weird here. And as you know, I got the gold vinyl, the 2020 gold vinyl. So I'm actually just looking for other issues. This one's the 2022. Obviously it's not a gold vinyl. It's numbered to 49. But I'm kind of just intrigued by the run of the curries in that area and want to see what they look like in the event that a gold vinyl shows up. And at that point maybe I'll pounce. And then the other one, just a sort of small harkening back to my Oakland A's fandom. I found this on the show floor of the the west coast card show. It's a 2000 Hudson Star Rubies. I'm trying to get the ruby action just right. It's a little hard to find the right spot, but it's numbered to 50. And you know, there I was just having, picking it, picked it up raw in the wild. I just threw it one of our, our cook brother tag friends and you know, they slabbed it up right there and sent it back to me. And I am super stoked just to have this in the PC. It joins a Jose Canseco from the same year that I have in a star Ruby. So a little bit of a homage to Oakland A's in the the Bash Brothers era. Nice, man. Well, first the curry. I love contenders ticket cards. I think they look great. I like the design. I like in that one that it's a, you know, they're side by side. The ticket and the full body shot of Steph is. It's a great looking card. They're shiny, so love that, man. Congrats on that one. And the Hudson, I mean star rubies are just beautiful. Looks great in that tag holder. So congrats man. Nice. And you found it raw on the show floor. What was it like buying that card raw in. In terms of. I mean they are condition sensitive. Were you. Did you inspect it? So how did you kind of. Did you. Were you concerned about what it would gray and what was the grade? I didn't even look at that. Well, I mean, somewhat shocking to me. It got a nine. Not because I didn't think it would grade, but you know, these things are condition sensitive. And when I did check in, they, they had the taco truck, the tag taco truck. And the head grader at the time said, yeah, we will have to take this back because there are backdoored copies and we want to make sure that this is not one of those. So it passed that authenticity aspect which is important for all 90s, you know, parallels and, and finding it it was one of those cards where I just instantly knew I'm going to buy this card regardless of what I have to pay, because. And I remember asking the dealer. It wasn't a dealer I recognized, but I said, where. Where is. Where did you find this? And he said, I was in a show in Tennessee and somebody brought it up to me. So that's kind of a cool little provenance. You know, you just keep those little details in your mind. I think there's only been two sales of this card ever, and I don't even know if there's any PSA or BGS pop. It's. You know, it's not like Tim Hudson is a Hall. Well, is he a Hall of Famer? Somebody can tell us in the chat. He's borderline hall of Famer. He definitely had a great career, but for an Ace fan, he was. He was a stalwart pitcher for a number of years. Cool, man. Well, good night. Nice pickups. We'll look forward to seeing your other two cards shortly here. But so back to this. These vintage MEM cards that I've picked up. So in my hand here is my current collection of vintage memorabilia cards. And by vintage, I mean, like, older players with modern in modern cards. This is as an example, and this is one that I didn't buy from Tim. This is one I bought since then. But this is a two. I think it's 2004. Upper deck, ultimate collection. A Warren spawn piece, which. With a really cool patch right there. And this one. Yeah. Numbered out of 4, 60, 52. Numbered out of 52. Really cool. The rest of them I've shown before, but, you know, there they are. A nice collection of names like Babe Ruth, Clemente, Ty Cobb, Jackie Robinson, Satchel Paige, Peewee Reese, Whitey Ford, Lou Gehrig, Joe Jackson and Yogi Berra. So that's what I have here. But I've shown those before. What I want to share with you now is the picture of the cards that I just picked up from Tim. Well, I haven't got them yet, but that we've made a deal on. And so he sent me a picture of them so I could share it. So I'm going to share that on the screen here. We'll kind of go through, but boom, there it is. And so you don't have to strain your eyes at this point. I'm going to sort of zoom in and sort of take us through them kind of one at a time, I guess. But these are all coming to me. I'm gonna. I'LL have them at the, at the National. We have this satchel page game used Jersey piece from 2004. I'm not going to go into each card talk about them too much. This might be one of my favorites in the lot. The Jackie Robinson satchel page D dual game used jersey from upper deck Ultimate. Here is a Joe DiMaggio upper deck ultimate collection. Ultimate achievements numbered out of 39. Love that as we come back down the side here. So we have the satchel over here. I picked up Eric from him to. Or sorry, this Ty Cobb which kind of pairs them together. I always like pairing up cards. Here's a Ty Cobb Ultimate Achievements which is from the same. That's at a nine by the way, which is from the same set as the Joe DiMaggio up here. So nice to have that pair. And then down here is a Joe DiMaggio Ted Williams dual game used jersey patch which goes nicely with the dual Jackie satchel because they're from the same set. So another nice pair there. Here's another Cobb fabrics of the game. Beautiful piece. And then, then oh, look at this from upper deck premiere the Joe DiMaggio remnants. And this has. It's tough to see here, but there are pinstripes on the, in the nine, the three and the nine. So num. Beautiful piece out of 36. Here's a Lou Gehrig fabric to the game. And there's a Jackie Robinson legendary. What's a legendary game worn jersey piece? So cool. And then three throwback threads. We got the Tony Gwynn, we got the Stan Musial and we got the Hank Aaron. So made a deal with tim on these 13 cards. I think it's 3, 6, 13. Yeah. On these 13 cards and can't wait to pick them up at the, at the National. So yeah, man, that's super cool and I love what you're doing there, Jay Lee. Just kind of like finding your way in this, this new oasis of. Of mem cards, especially with the older ones I wanted to show. So this, this isn't a mail day, but these are cards that I did actually somewhat recently get graded because they'd been in my collection for a long time. About a year ago I sent them off to sgc. First one pairs nicely with. With. With your Jackie Satchel. And actually you can probably tell if we go back to your Jackie Satchel that the uniform is, you know, bang on the same. The same uniform. You know, it's kind of like a golden almost like burlap sack looking tone there to, to Jackie. And then the other one. This is not an issue that you had in yours, but it's in the spirit. Oh yeah. When it was a game, Jackie. And again, you know, just a piece of swatch there. And you know, one of the nice things actually about the SGC label, I know you and I argued about, you know, the relative merits of the tuxedo, but I do like that on the flip they give you the number out of 50, which you know, it's kind of just helpful to not have to like turn it around. It gives a little bit more information on the front side of the, of the flip. Which I appreciate. Yeah. If I could, if I could have one wish. Well, no, if not one, but I'll wish of mine for grading companies would be to put the serial number of the card on the front of the flip front of the label to see it. Especially when the serial numbers on the back of the card like you said. So. Yeah. Those are awesome. Dude. I love that you have those. They're right up my alley. So beautiful cards. Beautiful. It's funny when you get a card that's sort of related to one of your friends cards, it's almost like you, you form an extra, extra bond. Like we have this, you know, the, the, the ultimate collection. Which of of the issues, like I just think the ultimate collection aesthetic is one of the best. And you have two now, right? You have the Jackie Satchel and the ted Williams and DiMaggio was it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean and those are just what great pairings those are. Yeah, absolutely. Well, so those are those. I'm, I'm, I kind of want to not look at that picture anymore because I want to, I want to look at them in person when I pick them up bas from now, five weeks from now and see them and be sort of, oh yeah, this one. Oh, I forgot about this one. You know, I wanna, I want to have that, that just that moment of excitement and freshness again. So I don't know how much more I'm gonna look at that picture between now and then. But. So as I mentioned that was, that was done on Friday, the night before. So this past Thursday, which Slap Sharks does their weekly Thursday sports card auctions on ebay. I picked up three cards from them and, and I'll, I'll share, I'll share those. So here's the first one I bought. It's a Jeremy Ronick upper deck Premier auto patch. Now it would be nice if there was some orange in that patch, but it is still a three color Patch with white, gray and black on card auto. I, I, Jeremy Ronick is one of my favorite guys to collect. I've got a lot of favorite guys to collect, but I like collecting his stuff. And the card was cheap for 67 Canadian, so I grabbed it. Sometimes when you're bidding on these auctions, at least I find once I win one card, I'm more prone to winning or bidding on more cards because I'm like, ah, they're already sending me a package. May as well just tuck this or that in there. So maybe that had a bit to do with it. The second card I bought was this one here. This is a 2005 upper deck SP game, used just a patch of Mike Bossy. But this card, when you, when I first looked, I was like, that's kind of boring. Just a black and white patch. But then I realized, wait a second. That's a part of the star from an All Star jersey. And if I look, if I turn the card over and look at the, at the words on the back, it actually says on the front of this card is an authentic piece of patch from a 1987 All Star Game jersey worn by Mike Bossy. I was like, oh, that's perfect. And on top of that, I've started putting together a little bit of a flight of these O5SP game use patch cards where the patches I like. So it fits into a little collection that I'm already building. So this was, that was cheap. 45 Canadian, like 30 US dollars. But then there was the big one I bought. Unless you have anything to say on, on this first. No, I just, I love when patches have sort of designation of when they were worn and I have a number of ones that are recognized as having been worn in All Star games. And I, I think that's just super cool. Kind of a singular event. You know, tying the card to a singular sporting event is, is, is really cool. Yeah, yeah, I think it's awesome. So. And Mike Bossi is a legend. One of, if not the greatest goal scorer of all time. A hearted heart heart to supplant Alex Ovechkin. But Mike Bossi is right up there, maybe the second best goal scorer of all time. Then the big card I bought. And here I'm before I now I'll just show you the card. Here's the big one I bought. It is a Patrick WA 2023 Upper Deck Ultimate Collection. This is the, it's called LA Collection ultimate, which is like the French version of Ultimate Collection. But if you notice the patch Window is. First of all, the patch is three colors. Red, blue, and white. But it's in the shape of the fleur de lis, which is the national flower of the province of Quebec. I believe I already had the mark Andre Flurry from this set, and I thought, I need the Patrick Wa to pair with it. There's a couple more I would like to find. Now, I paid, as you can see, 1481 Canadian dollars. That's a lot for this card. I think it's a lot for this card. But here's what happened with this card at the Sport Card Expo back at the very beginning of May. You know, bought a couple cards. I was in the evening. I was hanging out with the guys from the Hockey Cards Gong show podcast at. At their Airbnb. And Phil, Loud Phil, some of you may know him from that. From the Gong Show. He showed a copy of this card. He's like, yeah, I picked this up. So I was like, what? Where did you find this? He's like, oh, I found it. Some guy had it and, you know, made him an offer, and he took it. I said, oh, how much did you pay for it? He's like, oh, I think he was asking 700. I got it for 600 bucks. I was like, holy crap, man. I'm like, that's amazing. I love this card. I go. I said. I said, man, I'd probably pay two grand for that card. I like it so much. So comes up on ebay on Slap Sharks. I'm watching it all week, hoping to get it for as close to what Phil paid for his. And I just. There's only 10 of them. I really, really, really, really wanted the card. So I was, like, getting my snipe bid ready to put into ebay. And, you know, I went from a snipe bid of like, 1222 to maybe 1333 to 1444. At the end of the day, my final decision for my snipe, I think I put it in my max bid at $1,777.77, and put in the snipe. Won the card, won the right to buy the card for, as you can see, 1,480. So, you know, more than double what my buddy paid for the exact same card just a month and a half earlier or so. But I thought he got a great deal, first of all. So that comp that he set by buying it, which is not a public comp, it's just, you know, we know about it, and now you guys know about it, too. I was like, I don't care. And I even said to him at. I said at that. That night after the show at their Airbnb, I'm like, I would have paid two grand for this card. So the auction's going on, and with, like, three minutes left in the auction, I turn on the Hockey Cards Gong show podcast, where they are covering the end of. Of the slab Sharks auction, and they're talking about this card. And little did I know that California Dave, who's part of their crew, was also wanting this card. And I. I thought he might be, because all three of us at the Airbnb talked about how we all had one or two cards from this set and we wanted more, but I was like, I'm getting it. So as we're. As I'm watching them and I'm. I'm bidding on the card, they're talking about, oh, I wonder if Dave's gonna get it. And then the bid comes in, the bids come in. They're like, oh, look at what it went for. I wonder if Dave won the card. And I type into the chat, I write, dave did not win the card. And they're like, oh, there's. Hey, Jeremy. What's going on? Hey, Jeremy says he didn't win it. I wonder. Let's. Let's hear from Dave. I'm like, no, no, guys, I bought the card, not Dave. And then Phil's like, oh, Jeremy, congratulations. I know you wanted that card. He's like, oh, that's great. I forgot that you wanted that card, too. Didn't even think about it. And he's like, wow, you paid 1400 bucks for. I'm like. I'm like, yeah. And I wrote in the chat, I go, phil, if you remember, I told you that night I would pay $2,000 for this card. And there I go, I didn't have to pay that much, but I had. I paid. And he's like, oh, yeah, you did say that. I forgot you said that. I'm like, hey, I'm. You know, I'm walking the walk as well as talking the talk. So only 10 of these. And then. Then Dave and I are texting right after. And he's like. He's like, congrats on the card. He goes. He goes, I just got another copy. There was another one on ebay. I had to buy it now. I just went and hit the buy it now. And I. I'm like, I didn't even realize that there was another copy on ebay. You know how oftentimes you'll See people asking the question publicly, like, how is this comp real? Someone just paid $1500 for a card. There's another one on eBay for 1300. Why wouldn't they just buy that one for 1300? Well, sometimes people don't see everything. And that was the case with me here. Calm, you know, maybe I should have. But he ended up buying that card for like 80 bucks less than like I paid. It looks like 1045 US he bought his for like a thousand US so he got it and it's basically the exact same car just with the colors on the patch flipped the other way. So fun card. I'm super excited. It'll go well with the Mark Andre Flurry. And now I need to find the Luke Robitaille and the Mario Lemieux to, to, to complete the flight from the set. So those were the three cards that I bought there. I bought the cards from my, my vintage mem pusher which I'll pick up at in Chicago here at the end of next month. But that was, that was kind of fun buying those cards on ebay back on Thursday. Very nice. Yeah, the ultimate collection Pedigree. And the foil and the on card auto and the colors in the patch. Like a lot of things to like about that card and not like not all cards are created equal. And you know, sometimes it just takes a sucker like me to. I don't know if I, I don't know if I overpaid or not. But the fact of the matter is now there's two comps, public comps on the on record. My, my Auction win and California Dave's Buy It Now Purchased. And they're both right around the same amount. So the next time one of these comes up, you gotta think the seller is going to expect at least 1400 Canadian on it or a thousand US because there's now two comps on the same day. Right. Tight together there in value and, and time proximity. So kind of interesting how that works. But after when he told me he bought the Buy It Now, I was like, oh my God, how much was it? What did I miss? And I was like, okay. In a way I was like relieved that he paid pretty much the same price I did. If it would have been a few hundred bucks cheaper. I've been like, ah, what a dummy. I didn't even think to go looking there. I was just looking at Slap Shark's auctions and came across it so pretty funny. That can bite you from time to time. I mean, I think I've gotten much Better at doing my research before I bid in terms of looking at the comps on, on card ladder. But it's always worthwhile looking on ebay before, before you do anything significant, just in case somebody's got it listed. Maybe it's a slightly better card. You know, there's, there's vagaries between each and every card that might make one a little bit more attractive to you. And, you know, the, the, the, the comp factor is one component, but there's also what's out there on the market right now. Absolutely, absolutely. It's, it's funny because, you know, it's good to go looking as I'm going through the Slap Sharks auctions pretty much every third Wednesday, Thursday, to see what I might want to buy on Thursday night. I'm not looking, I'm not going and comping out every card. I'm not going and seeing what else might be available. I'm kind of just focused there and I don't know. Listen, I'm, I'm also, I'm also a, an affiliate, a rep for Slab Shark. So I guess I'm glad to know that that, that happens. For people of my clients who are consigning cards, there are. Maybe there's other people out there like me who are just looking at those and not others, you know, on a regular basis. I look at other cars all the time, of course, but anyway, any final thoughts on that? Yeah, just, I mean, it's, it's, it's a, it's strange because the times that I've paid over comps at the moment, I feel a little chagrined. But then usually overall, my instincts prove to be right, that, you know, it was a good time to go over comps. Alternatively, sometimes I don't bid on cards because I'm a slave to the comps and I can regret it. I'm like, oh, why did it, why did I not push in further? Because that's a card that comes in so rarely. So it is just, again, it's a, it's a piece of data, as you are. Want to say, Jay Lee? There's a lot of context behind it. There's a lot of details and subtleties to even understanding what a comp is or what to make of a comp. And it's, I guess, just in my own experience, it's, it's good not to be too bought into the idea that you would never pay over comps because you might miss out on some really good opportunities. Exactly. You know, it's so true. And like I've been saying a lot lately, I trust myself more than I trust the everybody else together. As far as what cards may be worth in the future, when it comes to buying a card for fourteen hundred dollars, I'm. I'm seriously thinking about what the, what, what the exit plan would be or the value plan would be when I do sell that card, whenever that may happen to be. And now in the case of this Patrick wa, I think I overpaid, but we'll see. You never know. Things do change. But in general, for what you were saying, like I will overpay for cards if I think that they are currently, if there's opportunity or potential for them to be appreciated more, valued more in the future. And let's say this, let's just take a card not to be, not even talk about that car, but any card. And let's say it sells for the last few comps are in, around, in or around $500. But you know, you might think that the card is going to be worth $5,000 down the road. It might be a card that you think is just under the radar. That's a big gap. But let's just use it for illustrated purposes. So it's five. You. The last comp is $500. You think it's got potential based on other cards of that player, that set, that era, the sport. It could be a $5,000 card in a few years maybe. Well, if you have to pay 800 or $1,000 for that card today, even though the Last comp is 500 and that comp might be from six months ago, for example, well, there's six months where you don't know what's happened to that card. There's been no comps in between, so there's no additional data point. But you might feel like, ah, you know what, maybe it's gone up. Maybe it's true value if put to auction instead of 500 like six months ago, would now be 7, 750, maybe $800. But you can't buy it for that. Seller wants $1,000. Okay, well listen, if I think that that card could be worth five grand in the future, what's the difference if I pay 500, 750 or 1000 today? Either way, if I think it's going to be worth five grand down the road, at worst, the value of that card for me is going to go up five times if I'm right. Obviously this is all hypothetical and we're putting out crazy numbers out there in the future. But like you said, Joe, when you've trusted your instincts and for me, when I've trusted my instincts and overpaid on a card, I don't know if I've ever gone wrong. It's always caught up and. And then and there and. And gone and gone past. When I bought my Michael Jordan jambalaya in, like, 2019 for $20,000, I over. I broke. I smashed the record for BGS 9.5 at $20,300. Didn't smash it, but I set the record at 20,300. Well, what if I was. What if the guy said I wanted 22. 5 and I said, I can't do it? Can't do it. But what if I thought the card was gonna be worth 60,000 bucks four years from then? What's the difference if I paid 20.3 or 22.5? Well, lo and behold, I sold that card for, I think it was 60 grand. A few years later, well, boy, would I be kicking myself if I. If he wanted 22. 5. And I said, no, I'm. I'm Max at 20,300. So sometimes you just gotta kind of go with what you think and don't be a prisoner to those comps, especially on a card that doesn't sell all the time. So I'm with you on that, buddy. Totally. Be brave. Be brave. Hey, one quick thing from Saturday night. I think it was Josh Adams that said sometimes, you know, if you've been looking for a card for a long time, it's like. And it comes up. It's like sometimes he. He just buys it to take it off his want list so he doesn't have to think about it anymore, which is like, that's worth that'. That's like a value in and of itself. It reminds me of, like, sometimes you're. You go through your save searches, and the same card pops up week after week, month after month, even year after year. And it's like, I'm. So. Sometimes I just want to delete the save search because I don't want to see that card anymore. But there's one card I'm waiting for to show up at some point, and I'll wait. I'll wait decades if I have to. And I know as soon as I delete that save search, it'll come up and I'll miss it. But I don't want to look at that card anymore for whatever reason, you know, mentally just bothers me. It's like, should I just buy it to get rid of it? So I can receive it and then give it away or sell it just to take it off of. Take it off. That result. Yeah, totally. You've got a. You've got a new show coming up on Thursday, right, which. Right around the corner. Yeah, just. Yeah, today. Yeah. So for when we're watching this show here on Wednesday the 24th, on Thursday the 25th at 5 o' clock Eastern, I will be going live for the very first time on Fanatics Live, which is for their new Collect original series. There's a. There's a group of content creators that they have engaged to create original content for their new platform. I say New because when you go to Fanatics, the Fanatics app on your phone, along the bottom there's a few different options that you can select. And for there's Marketplace which will take you to the premiere, the weekly and the fixed price. There's the collection which shows you the cards you have in the vault. There's your account, but then there's this little one called Live right there. And if you go to Live, there's a bunch of these little pills here. Oh, there's a bunch of these pills here across the top. Of course now my phone's not showing it, but so it's hard to see, but. Oh, crap. Okay, there they are. I got my finger right up there across the top, you can see those. And one of them is Collect Originals, the one that I have selected right there. And if you go there, you've got now all these new thumbnails for Collect Original Shows coming. So Adam Gray did ask Adam this morning, is he still going? No, he's not still going. That is now over. But he did Collect Originals. And then down here you can see right there the Hunt with, with me, Jeremy Lee that is coming on Thursday and excited for that. So that's it right there. Thank you Joe for being there. So there will be. There is a link in the video description here below. I kindly ask that if you, if you are interested in checking out the Hunt exclusive on Fanatics Live to go use the specific link here in the description because Fanatics gave a different like referral link to all of us Collect Originals content creators and it would be very. I'd be grateful and helpful for the support of clicking that link, having your account. There's no trans. It's not a transactional platform. Collect Originals. It's all about content. It's basically like going to YouTube and, and having various content to choose from to watch. No price, no cost, just simple content. And of the, however Many content creators that are contributing collect originals. You're probably not going to want to watch all of them, but just like on YouTube, you might want to watch some of them. So please check it out. I'd be very grateful. I'm excited for the first episode of the Hunt here on Thursday. It's a new streaming software that I'll be using, so we'll see how that goes. But yeah, I'm excited. That'll be. That is scheduled to be just about every Thursday at 5:00 Eastern. And the weekly and the premiere shows that I do for Fanatics I've been doing for six years, will also be streaming as well. In addition to YouTube, also to fanatics Live. But the Hunt is only on Fanatics Live and we'll and on the website or the app like I showed you. And there will be giveaways as well. At least one giveaway per episode too. So should be fun. Looking for. Thanks for asking, Joe. I'm excited about, about that. And yeah, doing the first one on Thursday here. The thing I like about it, and I'm glad that Fanatics is supporting it, is when you do your weekly, sometimes it's all like a shotgun wedding, you know, it's like everything's happening so quickly. I'm assuming the Hunt will be looking at auctions that are still 48 hours away from closing and that's helpful to those of us who want to scout it out a little bit more ahead of time. You know, I'm pretty impulsive, but it would probably be helpful for me to watch the Hunt just to kind of get a little bit more time before the auction is, you know, in its closing moments. Exactly. So that's what the Hunt is, is the Hunt is going to be me and the chat scouring for cards that we will end up watching on the Sunday night show as they are actually ending. So the, the, the fun thing is that people who are in the chat on the Hunt will help shape Sunday night's show, which will be streaming again to YouTube and fanatics. So that's pretty cool. And then once we get into a cycle, what I think I'm going to be doing for the giveaway is during the Sunday night show, I will plan to buy a card from the Fanatics Weekly auction to be given away on Thursday during the Hunt. So this Thursday's Hunt, the first episode of the Hunt, which is tomorrow. I'm not yet sure what we're going to give away, but the next week it'll be a card that I bought on Sunday on fanatics to give away on the next Thursday. So we just got to get that cycle started. But that's the plan. But the, the fun cool thing too is that the hunt actually gives people a bit of an insight into how I prepare for my shows because I already go through the fanatics weekly auction to prepare for the Sunday night show and selecting the cards to watch. That process is basically the hunt in a way, but with the, with the live viewers contributions and suggestions as well. So should be really exciting. It'll be similar to the Sunday show in that we're going to look at cards, but it's going to be like, hey, do I, do I care about this one? Why do I, why don't I. People might say, hey Jeremy, why aren't you looking at this card over here? Well, I don't care about that card or I don't collect that player. I don't like that card or you're right. Thank you for letting me know. Missed that one. So we're gonna be hunting for fun cards looking for cards that have, you know, maybe some maybe are undervalued. I don't like saying undervalued, but might, might slide under the radar cards that I think might have future potential that aren't, you know, that isn't there. But I really don't want to be giving investment advice or steering people towards cards that they can get hurt on. So I'll have to lay down a bunch of disclaimers that way. So. But yeah, the hunt on Collect Originals. Check it out. Please do click that link below, guys. Greatly appreciate it. Oh, I also wanted to mention I have my. It's not so new anymore, but my second Instagram account is, is I just put on the screen here, it's at J. Lee underscore cards and I've been putting PC cards on there and I hadn't added any cards for like three weeks. Just, just so busy preparing for the hunt and preparing for Enter the Inferno at the, at the national that next month. And finally the other day I added like 10 more cards. So check that out. Follow my, my PC account at Jaylee Underscore cards on Instagram, guys. You can follow Joe too on Instagram. Joe. Let me. If I take that off. Oh, we don't have your Instagram here under your name, but you are @cali dreaming84 on Instagram if I remember correctly. Isn't that right? You are correct. Cali Dreaming. Cali Dreaming. Joe Pro Instagram, Instagram. And then last thing I'll mention, just because there's been a lot of talk about it lately. Hobby Spectrum, a prod project I've been working on for close to a year now, is up and live and running and had a lot of, a lot of people take the assessment in the last couple weeks and opting themselves into the directory, which is awesome. Go to the hobby spectrum.com if you haven't yet take the assessment, opt into the directory and add all your information. It allows you to add the team teams, players and sports you collect. And it's all very standardized. It allows you to add your links to your to, to whatever really any social media account you have any, any hobby platform you're a member of, if you have your own website, if you have your own podcast, your own YouTube channel, even your eBay store, your Com C portfolio, your card ladder showcase, you can add links to all these things there. And it's all going to become even more useful. Right around the national we are going to be rolling out the, the next phase of the Hobby Spectrum which is in beta. I'm working very hard at it when I, when I'm able to find time and, and, and populating it with some really cool stuff. But the Hobby Spectrum is about to become a lot more than what it is and another features that have never been done before. So these things don't, they're not competing with anybody, they're free for everybody to use and they're things that everyone in the hobby can use. So check it out and stay tuned for these, those upcoming features which I'm super pumped about. So. Okay, thanks for letting me mention all that guys. Here on the Hangover exclusive content on the sports card clubhouse. Thank the my team over at the clubhouse. Content coming out pretty much every day on the clubhouse. If you're not yet watching it, be sure to, to check it out. So. All right, Joe, we're at the, we're at the like 38 minute mark or so 39 minutes but we had a top another topic to talk about. You want, you want to hit it or you want to save it for another episode? Let's hit it. Let's hit it. Joe, everybody out there, I just want to let you all know that my cards are worth more than your cards are. Damn straight they are. My cards are worth more than yours, Joe. My cards are worth more than everybody's out there. No, no, no, no, no. My cards are worth more than your cards. My cards are better thin your cards. So we're obviously kind of, kind of half joking around, but I was having this Thought, Joe, this thought has been on my mind for a couple months now in that, you know, we often, we often see people almost calling out other hobbyists on Instagram or YouTube or wherever, saying that, oh, this, you know, ah, this guy's got these cards for sale. Or he's got a card that I want and I asked him how much it was and it's like, oh, you know, he wants fifteen hundred dollars, but you know, it's not worth that much. It's a thousand dollar card, but he wants fifteen hundred dollars for it. I don't understand why. And I started thinking about that, about, you know, why is it that people do value their cards more than maybe other people's cards? And I have an answer, I have an answer as to why my cards are worth more than yours. But, but saying my cards are worth more than yours or his cards are worth more than mine, or oh, he thinks his cards are worth more than mine. Well, he thinks his cards are worth more than mine because they are his cards in many cases. I think there's a name, there's a name for that, Joe. What's that, what's that called? It's called the endowment effect, which possession of something makes you value it more highly, whatever, whether it's sports cards. Maybe you're, you know, you're 69 Porsche. Okay, the. That's what. Right. Thank you. The endowment effect. And I think what. The endow. How the endowment effect really makes its way into the hobby, at least for me, because I do truly feel like my cards are worth more than if they were not my cards. I don't care who you are or if it's. They're your cards or my cards. I'm. What I'm saying is I have cards in my collection, Joe, that, you know, if I were to look at comps might be worth that they would be. Those comps would be lat were those comps would be lower than what I would be willing to let my card go for. Now, I'm not looking to sell these cards. These cards are not for sale. But if someone comes to me and says, hey, hey, Jay Lee, I want your, your Jackie Robinson 48 leaf. You know, it's a, it's a, it's not, it's a terribly off centered PSA 6, I say, yes, it is a terribly off center PSA 6. And they might say to me, well, you know, a terribly off center PSA 6 is worth $40,000. And I might say, okay, well, why do you say that? Well, Jaylee, because look, at this comp. $40,000. Okay, fair. So I'll give you 40,000 for yours. I'll say no, you can have it for 60. I'm not letting go for 40 grand. If you really want to, I guess I could let it go for 60,000. Oh, he thinks his cards were 60,000. The compensate for. This guy's full of it. Who does he think he is? Well, no, that's not, that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying, if you want, you can have over 60. What I'm saying is that's what it's going to take to get it from me. Number one, it's not for sale. I don't have a price tag on it. I'm not presenting it. I'm not saying come strong with offers. I'm not even putting it out there. It's my card. And the difference between the last comp and what I want for it is I think there's a few components of that gap. One of those components is the potential value accretion that I see happening over time. And the second is that I have the comp value, which I understand. Okay, the one just maybe sold for 40. Okay, that's a baseline. But I'm going to layer on top of that what is called emotional value. The fact that it is my card and it's not your card. A bit of the endowment effect actually at play. So unless I'm in a position where I want or need to liquidate the card for cash, I don't need to sell it for 40. I can put a price of 60 on it and say, take it or leave it. I don't really care either way. I'm. I'm going to be very happy. I'll either get 60k, go buy another one for 40, 45, and be very happy with the $15,000 profit, or I'm going to keep it and sell it down the road for 60 anyway, because that's what I think is going to happen. I might be wrong, but if I'm not. So the difference between 40 and 60 is a bit of future value, you know, estimations, and the rest is that emotional value. And that's, I guess what I'm all getting is I think a lot of people overvalue their own cards in many cases because they have emotional value into the card. They've invested not just money, but time and, and enjoyment into owning the card. Where they've looked at it, they grow attached to it. I grow attached to these material items. I grow attached to these cards, to the specific copies that I own that I love. And as long as I'm still in love with them, you're not gonna be able to buy my cards off me at comp. If they're my personal cards, as soon as I move them out of my personal collection box and into either my limbo box or my inventory box, they are priced with emotional value built in. As soon as they come out, it's like, Joe, as soon as it comes out of my PC box and enters into my limbo or my inventory box, that emotional value almost disappears in my mind mentally, I'm like, okay, that emotional value has gone from 20k on this, Jackie, let's say to zero. Because I'm now willing to move it. I now want to move it or I have to. So again, I'll just repeat one more time when people, when you hear somebody say that this guy thinks his cards are worth more than anybody else's, understand the context. Is it a card they want to sell? Is it a card they put out for sale, or is it a card they don't want to sell that you ask? You inquired about. I had a guy reach out to me the other day through my personal Instagram account. Jaylee underscore cards. My Hank Aaron rookie, my 54 tops Hank. He sends me a DM. He goes, hey, can I. Can I buy your 54 tops Hank Aaron rookie, or can you give me a price on it? Now, at the top of my account, it says, these are personal collection cards. They're not for sale. But he asked anyway. I said, I said, I said. He said, can you give me. Just give me any price on it? I said, well, you're not going to want to pay it. But since you said any price, I think I quoted him $25,000. Comps are about 10 or 12 grand. He writes back and he goes, can you give me a more reasonable price? And I said, no, I cannot. No, it's not for sale. So if you want to extract my Hank Aaron from my collection, I am going to make you pay to the point where you're not going to buy because I don't want to sell my copy. So, no, it's not for sale. Now, if he goes and tells anybody, oh, Jeremy thinks his cards are worth more than anyone else's. He wants 25 grand for the card. Listen, it's called the not for sale price. Don't ask for a price. Don't ask for the not for sale price. If you're going to go like, make fun of me, like, what's that? You know, it's not for sale. You want it, you're going to pay through the nose. Otherwise, leave me alone. So sometimes you're better off just saying no. But he said any price. All right, you said any price. Here's the price. But you're not. I preface it by saying you're not going to pay it anyway. So. All right, over to you. Your thoughts on the topic. Well, you brought up a lot there. I mean, the emotional side, the aspect of maybe not even really being committed to selling the card or not wanting to sell it at all. To me, this kind of harkens back to my early days of collecting in the 80s, before cards were graded, because I, I learned this about myself early on. Every time I would bring a card that I had in my mind, you know, let's say in my mind it was a near mint card, you know, full book, as we used to say in the day. And the dealer would look at it and say, absolutely not. This is, you know, this is a VGX card. And he would explain why. And usually the dealers, you know, there were some corrupt dealers that might try and swindle you a little bit, but back then, I mean, most people were pretty, pretty straight up and, you know, they would educate me. I was a younger collector in those days, so they probably felt some compulsion to sort of instruct me and, you know, assessing condition, which was helpful because time and time again, I overvalued the actual condition of my card in a way that was in my favor. And I think it had a lot to do with my emotional connection to the card and my desire to, you know, get as much as I could out of it if I'd reached the point of wanting to maybe swap it or trade it or cash in on it somehow. So I think there is, there's been that component for a long time in the hobby. And there's also, it's, it's good to recognize, you know, whether it's the situation where you don't want to sell the card or in some cases there are dealers who just don't particularly. It's like they're set up. They do appear to want to sell the card, but they don't want to sell the card that badly. And you have to kind of know who you're dealing with. And so sometimes, just a few questions, you, you know, the, in, in your case, you weren't trying to shop around your Hank Aaron card, this guy was coming down your road trying to get you to name A price that worked for him. But in another connection, in other contexts, you might be at a show and just kind of learn somewhat quickly that the person that you're dealing with is not, you know, is overvaluing their cards for whatever reason. You know, at a certain point, it's like the why isn't as important as just like, okay, this, this is a dealer that is not as motivated and maybe hasn't done the self inventory of what a. A fair. What I would consider a fair market. And that's fine. Everyone's going to have their own internal sort of barometer of what makes sense to. To let go of a particular card. There's an embedded bias, I think, just because at some point we made the choice, the conscious choice to acquire that card. And so we clearly have felt like your MEM cards there, you were won over by them, each and every one of them. I like this one. What do I like about it? Oh, I like, I like the image. I like the way the MEM looks. I like the fact that it's a cool, you know, a low, A low pop count. I like the fact of the aesthetic of the card. You've already been won over. So there is sort of an internal bias to begin with of why we might value our cards more. More so than someone that's just looking to get into it. And you have a story like the Patrick Roy that you were showing, you actually saw that card in person, right? You were there with your friend when you, he acquired it and you were like, whoa, that's pretty cool. And so you have an extra layer of attachment to something when there's a story involved and you know, an experience, a lived experience that you had. Yeah, yeah, great thoughts, man. And you know, one of the, one of the things that I think helps build this emotional value or this, the leads to the endowment effect is I think you, you, you. What? Something you said made me think this is you. Like for example, with my Hank Aaron, I wanted that card for 10 years before I found and bought the. Pulled the trigger. I think I spent years searching. Not, not like it was the only card I searched for, but I looked at many, many, many. So I was very selective. The copy I ended up buying, like, I love my copy. You know, these are not just interchangeable with any other copy, even in the same grade. So yeah, I put in the time and effort to source it. To me, there's, there's. That just adds to the. To. To the intangible value to, to the. Again, the emotional value, I guess. And it's fair. It's. So here's the thing. I don't expect anybody to pay for my emotional value. You don't have to pay my. I will not pay for your emotional value. I'm not going to buy a card from you that I, that I think you have 500 overpriced or, or $15,000 overpriced. I'm not going to pay you for your, your emotional value. You would be stupid to pay me for my emotional value. But the car is not for sale. In many cases, it's about cards that aren't even for sale. So it's a very personal thing. But to give yourself a little more credit than that is what you mentioned about sourcing the card. This is the byproduct of you having 40 years of collecting experience. So there is the emotional value, but there's also your eye, your perseverance in the search. And so I might actually pay. I wouldn't consider it the emotional value, but for the sort of expertise that went into that acquisition and I mean, we see that in the eye appeal movement all the time. Right? Like, people are acknowledging, like, for you to have found that card, like whatever the circumstances were, maybe you lucked into it. But generally speaking, I think, you know, luck is a combination of opportunity and being in the right place at the right time luck. So it's, it's a little bit more than just like, pass your luck on. To me, it's like, no, I've been at this a long time and so there's going to be some victories that I'm not just going to give away. Right. And I agree, I agree with that. Like, I will, I will pay extra for a card with high eye appeal. And if I'm selling a card that has high eye appeal for, relative to the technical grade, I am going to expect more money for that relative to comps. But I'm, but I'm also, as if I'm the seller, not only am I going to want to get like the base value plus the I appeal premium, I also am going to want to get my emotional value premium. If you are really coming at me for a card I don't want to sell, but I. So I expect you to pay the base premium and I expect you to pay the I appeal premium. I don't expect you to pay the. I don't expect you to pay my emotional value premium because I would not pay. I will pay you for base. I will pay you for eye appeal, but I'm not paying you for your Emotional value component of the overall price tag, if that makes sense. So I think that's how I look at it. So whenever, whenever I see someone say, oh, he, he's crazy on his prices. Well, hey, there are people that are crazy on their prices, don't get me wrong. But the other thing is. Let's understand the context of why they are the other. Another thing I want to kind of talk about in this topic is when you're set up at a card show and. Or you go to a card show, you see a guy with a car with cards on display and there's no prices on the cards. And then you ask, you ask them how much is the card? And oftentimes they will just, they'll either give you an exorbitant price, which makes you kind of walk away and not look at anything else in their showcase that even has prices, or they say, not for sale. Well, I'd rather you just told me not for sale because that way you don't have to give me a price that I might not understand the context of. At a couple Toronto expos ago, I had a showcase filled with personal collection items that I didn't want to sell, but people were at. But I also don't want to be the guy that doesn't have prices on my cards. So for the first day on the Thursday, I put prices on them, but they were not for sale prices. And I had people looking at them and being like, you know, and then not looking at the other showcases, I'm like, so by the next morning I came in, I took all the price tags off and I put not for sale because I didn't want to, you know, I didn't want to present as being overpriced. I'd rather just be like, not for sale. These are for display only and to attract attention, to bring more cards to the booth to get to buy, that kind of thing. So when you are shopping at a card show and you come across a table that either has crazy prices or no prices, at least have the conversation with the vendor, find out where they're coming from before you judge what they're doing is my advice. Although I don't like cars without prices because, you know, I don't want to have to negotiate for the seller. And then the final thing that ties into this is, at least in my mind right now, is when I'm out buying a card, sorry, I've got cards in my collection and obviously. And if I have a card in my collection that I could go sell for $5,000 right now. I'm just picking that number out of the blue. If I did not have that card, would I go buy it for five grand right now? And if the answer is no, then it's like, well, why don't I sell the one I already have? I think this ties into the endowment effect because I look at my cards. I think my cards are well endowed. My cards are well endowed with. Fulfilled with all this research and sourcing activity and, you know, the evolution of what I like to collect, all culminating in the moment I pick up a card and all that. So if I. I always have struggled, if I wouldn't buy this card now, why don't I sell it? Well, because I do own the card. I have the card. I don't want to sell it. Things we own, we value more. This is the endowment effect. I believe things we own, we value more than things we don't. And I'm okay. I'm okay that the endowment effect is in my psyche. It's part of my psychology. It doesn't bother me that I will not. I don't want to sell a card, even though I would not buy it right now for the same price. I've struggled with that in the past. I just take it as what it is. What can you. What can you add to that phenomenon, Joe, before we wrap up this. Yeah, I kind of fumbled when I said that old adage about luck. Luck, the one I was searching for was luck is the convergence of. Of opportunity and preparation. And like, for instance, with your Babe Ruth acquisition. Your goudy Babe Ruth. Yes, you had the opportunity of walking into that shop, and that car just happened to be there. But you also had the preparation of understanding this is a massive opportunity, and you knew you were not walking out of that store without acquiring that card at that point. So preparation is sort of in this context, like all of our experiences leading up to this moment, to know when something has value above, below, whatever the comp. Whatever the, you know, market value might be, and pouncing. Right. And. And. And actually making it happen. So, you know, just because you had a lucky moment doesn't mean you should share that lucky moment with everybody else. Go find your own lucky moment. Go find your own convergence of opportunity and preparation. Yeah. Yeah. Well said, man. All right, dude. Well, listen, let's wrap this up. Fun episode here of the Hangover dropping on Wednesday, June 24, exclusively on the Sports Card Clubhouse Network. These are fun episodes, Joe. This is the Hangover from Sports Cards Live. We'll be back on Saturday night on Sports Cards Live with the Saturday Night live stream. Check me out tomorrow on Fanatics Live. Please click the link below. It's a referral link so they'll know I sent you. I'd greatly appreciate that. Go to the hobby spectrum.com take the assessment, opt into the directory, add all of your what you collect and all your links, pops and comps available on Amazon to this day and enter the inferno. Coming to you live at the National. That's a. That's a summary of all the projects I have on the go right now on behalf of Joe Perot, the whole Sports Cards Live team. This has been the Hangover and our cards are well endowed.