The Jackie Patch Guy Responds + He Still Has No Regrets + A Heated Hobby Debate

Michael Jordan Sports cards is a lifestyle Sports cards and we live now Jeremy Lee in the building and every guess that you ever needed Sports cards after hours Keep the hobby heated Updates, homie. Talk like you never seen it Sports cards live and I could ever beat it Sports cards is a lifestyle Sports cards and we live now. Welcome to another episode of Sports Cards Live with your host, Jeremy Lee. Okay, Chris and Josh, any topics on your guy? Are either of you guys able to join the discussion? No pressure. Seriously, if you, you can, you're good. Josh, Chris, how about you? Are you, are you. Because Chris, I don't want you to miss out on anything here. Yeah, can I address a comment from the chat? Yeah, can you let me know who it was? It's from Alex Bridgeforth and he's asked a few different times about TAG getting. Yeah, there it is. Do you want to introduce the question? Sure. Alex Bridgeforth asks, asks to Chris, any chance tag grading gets added to card ladder in the future? Yeah, great question. So first of all, we already have I don't know how many tag sales. If a sale of a tag card has happened in a public setting, we've in all likelihood captured it. So already I don't know how many sales that would be probably hundreds of thousands, maybe millions. We, we have those sales in card ladder. So like as a, as a entry level threshold part of this discussion, we have those sales. If you're looking for historical sales data, sales data as it comes in in real time from tag, it's in there now. Okay, so now he's asking, but what about the POP reports? So we are quite amicable and have made several attempts and would love to incorporate population data from tag. And that olive branch is out there dangling in the wind. So we would love to be able to bring population data from, from tag into card ladder. And I appreciate their urgency to me as a, as a, as somebody who works on card ladder and I would very much encourage you to bring that same vigor to the door of the great people at TAG and perhaps encourage them to, to collaborate with us so we can get that pop data into Guard Ladder. That'd be amazing. David Chase. Yeah. I have a question for you hoj, about pop data. And just because I've never had this conversation with you and you are in, you have all the information from POP reports. I mean the pop reports are so off right with the crack in reeslab. Well, do you think that we will ever have an idea of true pop reports of cards? Is there any way some people. It's not Common. But some people do send back in their labels. I, I think Jeremy can probably corroborate that. Jeremy, haven't you sent some of those back in from time to time? Maybe, or maybe I'm not thinking of you. You don't grade. No, I, I've never sent back in. I've, I've, well, but I've never, I've never cracked and Reese, no, I, I, that's not true. I, I've cross submitted, I've cracked out like a Becket to send to a PSA or whatever. I've done a KSA to a PSA and no, I have not sent in those labels and I've also cracked and kept raw. That's probably what I've done the most is just cracked out and kept raw. And I've never sent in those labels ever. And I don't know that I would. I'm like, listen, I shouldn't say that. I don't know that I would. What I'd rather do is just take them to the national and hand them over to them there. But I really have find it hard to believe that those would make it back to the database. If they want to send me a self address stamped envelope, I'd probably be willing to do it. But yeah, I mean, listen, in a perfect world I would, you know, for the good of the hobby. In a perfect world I would but I mean the, the 10 times I've done it, it's, it's a, it's a drop in the bucket. But to answer David's question, I know he asked you hoj I think the answer is no. David, we're never going to know. The cat's out of the bag on it. It's too late. It's too late. There's way too many phantoms in the pop report already to ever be able to get accurate pop reports. You just have to know and come up with a ratio of accuracy that you're comfortable with. I used to think that was 95% and Bobby Burrell would tell me no, you're crazy, Jeremy. It's 65 or 70% accurate. Like you know, mo like 30, 25, 30 are phantoms. I'm. No way Bobby. It's like five. He's like, no, I've come to his side of that. I think it's a lot closer to his number than my number. So back to you. Ho, yeah, exactly, Jeremy. And the point that I was going to add, I wanted to open with something positive and then deliver the negative blow seconds. And here's the downside, the, the bad part is that it only gets worse with time. This isn't a problem that gets better with time. This is something that only compounds, and I'm not even sure it linearly compounds either. I think it might just sort of. For some cards, the POP Report might be filled with cracks and resubmissions and they might have been very popular to do for like a window of time. Like there's, there's a famous example of one of the LeBron rookie cards that's numbered to 250 and the Beckett pop report has 300 plus of them. And there was like this window of time when people were just like, they just love to hammer Beckett with resubmissions for that specific card. And so like, we can't even extrapolate and say, like, well, if there's 300 and we know there's 250, then that's increasing incrementally and we can sort of try and guesstimate how much that will change over time. We can't even do that because cards go through eras where it's very popular to resubmit them for a period and then, you know, that card kind of settles and people, you know, leave them in the slabs after a while. So it's just, it's, it's almost an intractable problem. And, you know, it has to be, you know, what is the spirit of pops and comps? Right? The spirit of that book is to interrogate everything, to use critical thinking, not to say things at face value and to come to independent judgments whether we're looking at eye appeal, supply, demand, comps, the whole nine. And I think we have to do that with POP reports too. It's annoying, it's frustrating. Not ideal, but each POP Report is probably going to need to be dealt with on its own. Yeah, well said, well said. Yeah, it's, it's a tough situation for a lot of, a lot of collectors and a lot and companies. And you know, I'm seeing a lot of comments in the chat about, you know, well, here situational says TAG has no reason to give a PSA owned company their data and that's okay. McGill's great at handling these hands, handling these questions all the time, which you are. But, but all that said, where did that comment go? All that said, I think that, you know, I don't know, I don't know why TAG hasn't responded to, to your outreach to incorporate their data. I don't know if it's because of the affiliation with PSA or Not. But I also see so, so I'm not. And people often look to me for these answers because they know that I'm affiliated or I was affiliated with TAG and I am an investor. I haven't a small investment in that company. And I see a lot of comments here about, you know, them, their shutting down certain tiers as well. I said this last week, it's not just PSA that is backed up. This is a systemic problem in the whole hobby, mostly caused by tcg. These companies don't want to, they don't want to shut down. They want to get your money. They want, they want all your money and you all want to give it to them. They want everybody's money but you can't give it to them because they don't have the capacity. They are all trying to grow and build as fast as they can and it's just, you know, just a matter of time before they do. And that's going to have its own challenges and, and its own problems are going to come out of that as well. Especially if they grow too fast and they, they lose control from decentralization, from maybe rushing candidates through the training and all these different things. It's just, it's just, it's just going to be, it's just going to be tough and it's a problem. It's not going to go for away for a while. You think how long it took card companies to issue their products after the pandemic when supply chain closed down. Like it took years. Yeah, it took like four years for card companies to catch up. I know. Upper deck. It took them a while. It took them a long time to catch up. I think it's going to take, especially if volumes don't slow down. Especially if submissions don't slow down. When PSA reopens, those lower level tiers, they're gonna get flooded. They're gonna get flooded with submissions unless they raise the price. That's their lever. That's their way to can, to, to slow the flow. So we'll see, we'll see what happens there. Lots there. Jim, I want to address Jimmy Kirby. Thank you for the super chat. Says Jeremy. Have you had a chance to look at Memory LA Auction? The Babe bat I think you're talking about. You said the Babe baa. If you mean the Babe bat. No, I haven't. I not really into bats myself. Jimmy Kirby. I have looked at some items on Memory Lane. I have some saved searches on my Auction Wire account that have taken me to the Memory Lane Auction and I do get the emails from memory lane as well. So I have looked at it, but I have not looked at that bat. Jimmy Kirby, but thank you for asking. Mike Petty says one out of a million people send in their labels. And then man of San Diego, welcome to the show, says, any thoughts on other grading companies that are not being Talked about for 2026? This. That seems to start growing ever since the shutdown of tiers by PSA and tag. He says, I tested mint authentication. Is that the Canadian company? Man of San Diego, there's an MNT grading company out of Canada. I'm not sure if that's what you're talking about. So anyone have any thoughts on. On the questions, like other grading. I mean we. I feel like everyone goes cgc, sgc, Beckett. I think Beckett's on the come up. I, I also think NBA is on the come up right now for. Great first for their slabs. I think they're going to be absolutely blasted at the national. They are going to be. It's gonna, it's like this is their, it'll be their coming out party for sure. As far as. Because a lot of people do respect that brand and, and the people behind it. So yeah, it's. Oh yeah, a lot of. Yeah. Josh. Josh is giving. Josh with his poker face that doesn't exist he Shade. So. So Josh, what's your issue with NBA? What's your problem with NBA, Josh? Nothing. I'm sorry, that was. No, no, you were snickering. What's. What's the issue with NBA? I don't know how many people respect them, but that's Google. Mike Baker. That's. That's all I'll say. I'm sorry. That's fine. No, I mean you, you can't, you can't hide what you're thinking because you show it on your face so much. So I'm just curious. What, what, what was going on there? I mean, vintage card says NBA won't be able to scale up either. No, I know. That's the thing. This problem is not a PSA problem. It's not a tag problem. It is, it's a systemic problem, guys. And I think it's TCG driven. I think if TCG disappeared, we sports collectors would be serviced much more fully and completely. David Chase. Yeah, I, I totally get you, Josh, about NBA and how there's a lot of people that are so against them and I completely get that. But when you're saying that there's a lot of people that are, you know, I've been Paying attention to what NBA slabs are going for. They are going for many, like close to PSA numbers for the, for the same grade in those slabs. And when I speak to dealers about it, they tell me the same thing, that they are at least where SGC is in their prices for cards. Now, obviously it's I appeal dependent, but you'd be surprised with how high those sales are going for. I don't own an MBA slab at this point, but, you know, there's more people that respect it than I think that you believe, Josh. Oh, for sure there is, David. Otherwise it wouldn't exist. Of course there is. Of course there is. You, you'll see, you'll see those lineups. The national are going to be absolutely bonkers for sure. Sammy Thunder says, will TCG cool off since PSA freezes their submissions? Will they swarm other grading companies as a response? Sammy, I think that's a really legitimate question. I have no, I cannot get into the mind of the TCG enthusiast to know how much of that Kool Aid they have consumed, to know whether or not they're willing to go elsewhere. I just don't know what that's like. So TCG is a relatively new thing. Pokemon is relatively new in North America compared to sports cards. It's really only been around for 25 years or so. Sports cards much, much, much longer. So I don't know, but I think they might be in bigger trouble than sports collectors are because, Because, I mean, that's the only thing that differentiates their cards. Like, you know, I know modern's not much different in sports, but vintage, it's, it's a whole different thing. The world of vintage versus moderns collecting are two completely different, almost two completely different products in a way. You know, one, vintage cards, Vintage cards have survived like full lifetimes of, of play and living. Modern cards just really have to survive shipping and grading that. They just have to survive that. There's not much to it. A modern card has a very easy life. Vintage cards did not really, you know, they've come up through a lot more trouble. They've, they've had more difficult lives. I, I guess you could say kind of fun way to, fun way to think of it. So what do you think? Anyone have any thoughts on any of this? All right, show's over. Okay, why don't we switch it up? Let's switch it up because there's a lot of comments in there. But I think it's a lot of rehashing a lot of things that we've sort of talked about many, many times. I wanted to go back to the Jackie Robinson patch card. Chris, you weren't here last week, but are you familiar? Are you, are you informed on that whole situation? Yeah, I am. And I gave Joe like 20 bullet points of notes because I was so interested in it and I just dumped my thoughts on him. But that was like a, that was a week ago. It feels like it was. Or two weeks ago or whatever. It feels like it was an eternity ago. Yeah, it does. It does. So why do we do this? As I mentioned in the description to this episode, I heard back from the guy we're calling Stan, not his real name. And I'm gonna put the email on the screen here. I will read through it and we can, we can talk about it and see what everybody thinks. Because now this is not a short email. So it's gonna take me a few minutes to get through this, guys. But if you did join us last Saturday and the Saturday before you are, I think it was those two episodes. You are aware of of the Jackie Robinson memorabilia card. I'll put it on the screen right now for people to see. So here's the card in question. This card sold on fanatics collect weekly auction a couple weeks ago for $9,900. It's a one of one. It's a 2011 playoff prime cuts Jackie Robinson triple patch with a buttonhole. And so in one of the patch windows. The other two patch windows are very nice, two color with stitching. Very interesting card. I love the card myself. So the, the purchaser of the card, I will just take it off. I'll, I'll get back into position here now. And he wrote back after listening to all of us in the chat talk about this last week. I wish, I wish I could situational. I just don't have that skill. So with that said, here's the email. He says, hey, Jeremy, school's finally out. I just listened to your discussion about the Jackie patch. I had my computer's volume turned up in my office and occasionally I would watch the crew discuss my situation. I was listening and watching on YouTube. It was funny and horrifying all at once. Very entertaining. I just wanted to give you an update. Feel free to update share if you'd like. I also want to share my final thoughts about my purchase. He's got five bullet points. Number one. First off, I'm not getting divorced. I've got 25 years of marriage equity built up. I'm a bit of a gambler, but I would never put my Marriage in jeopardy over a baseball card. I still haven't told her. She's going to be pissed. But rest assured, my marriage is going to be fine. Number two, I put the card on a home equity line of credit. Not a credit card. I have 12k in credit. I already had 1200 on it, so like I said, 10k was all the higher I could go. Putting 10k on a credit card, now that would be stupid. I'm saying that sarcastically. The home equity line of credit is also a horrible financial idea and not recommended. Little better interest rate, but still not smart. I work summer school. I'll make about five grand. I also work another odd job. Over the summer months, I'll make another 1500 or so going into fall. I'm hoping to have about 90% of it paid off by September. I'm 50 years old. I've been collecting since I was in kindergarten. I'm not a newbie. Certainly don't know everything about every set or every insert, but trust me, I know what I'm doing. Also not a pump and dump profiteer. I thought that comment was kind of funny. That was Skeppy's comment from last week that he was addressing there. Number four, this is where Josh Adams. We're gonna see. Guys, watch Josh Adams face for this paragraph, okay? You want to see a poker face? Watch Josh Adams face for this paragraph. Number four, try Josh. See if you can do it. Let's see if Josh cannot divulge his feelings, okay? Number four, there are people in this hobby who only collect base kind of stuff. These are mostly vintage guys with rubber bands around their inventory. And the only distinction they make in a card is the PSA grade. The eye appeal movement caught them off guard and a lot of them still reject the eye appeal argument. Not saying that's Joshua Adams, but it might be. I don't know Joshua. Josh. Sorry. Josh just took himself off the screen for a moment. He goes, I don't. Where did I leave off here? I don't know Joshua. He might be a titan of the industry. Doesn't strike me as a visionary, though. But like I said, I don't know him. His argument that there's a hundred Jackie Jersey cards out there is pretty ridiculous. He's right. Those are napkin patch jersey pieces. Those cards aren't in the same ballpark. There's a lot of LeBron James cards out there, too. That's like comparing an exquisite rookie card auto with a 2024 Prism base. Not the same thing. On the other hand, there's also pure Speculators and flipper guys both are fine. Some of these guys have made hundreds of thousands speculating on one of one Logoman cards that are straight off the racks of Dick's Sporting Goods Player worn or event worn. I think it's completely stupid. Not to mention the 20 plus 1 of 1 cards in today's product. That kind of stuff doesn't appeal to me much but a lot of people collect it. Once again not my thing but to each their own. And then number five, lastly about my card specifically, I think someone mentioned it was unlicensed. Maybe I heard wrong. It's a higher end Panini product from 2011. Panini's game used guarantee and connection with Jackie Robinson.com both listed in the card are about as good of a provenance as you're going to find in the modern era sports card world. Also, it being in a PSA slab made me feel better about the auto patch being authentic as well. I'm gonna jump in here myself and say that should give you no feeling, no better feeling about the patch being authentic at all. Grading companies do not authenticate the patches in cards. That was me back back to Stan. He said I had seen the other versions of this patch on card ladder. I know the same card had recently sold for less than half of what I paid for it. It didn't matter to me. Like I said earlier, I, I truly believe this is the single greatest patch card ever made. Nobody will ever chop up a piece. Nobody will ever chop and piece out an early Jackie game jersey ever again. It's just not going to happen. There is not a tops 1956 PSA 5 Jackie that I can find at almost any decent car. Sorry, sorry. What does he say? There isn't a, there isn't a tops 56 PSA 5 Jackie that I can find. I think he's saying there, I think he's saying he can find a tops PSA 5 jacket at almost any decent card show in the country on any given weekend. This card hadn't surfaced for years and I didn't know if I'd ever see it again. So he saw it once. He, he does acknowledge that it sold once before. Like about a year ago he bought it the second time it was sold. But before that he's saying it hadn't surfaced in years and I didn't know if I'd ever see it again. I knowingly paid more because I felt this was the best one out there and this was my chance to grab a special, a truly special museum worthy piece. I Challenged anyone out there to find a better patch card considering player historical re. Relevance and true rarity. And then his closing. He writes, last night, the movie air happened to be on tv. The movie is about a guy from Nike, Phil Knight, he's talking about that landed Michael Jordan and his unwavering. Or no, it was the scout, so the other guy. But anyway, the movie is about a guy from Nike, how he landed Jordan and his unwavering belief in what he felt was the right decision. Good show. I recommend it. The guy believed in mj. He. He didn't care what anyone told him. He could feel it. That's how I am with this card. I really don't care what anyone says. I know it's special. I've never seen such a rare piece so completely slept on by the hobby. I have no regrets. I think it's a million dollar card. I stand by what I. I stand by that one last this or that for you, my Jackie. Or this Wemby out of five with an event warm patch that sold for over $100,000 this weekend. There's going to be dozens with these kinds of. Of these kinds of Wemby cars. Take care of the Stan. And he shows me this Wemby card. I'm showing it on the screen. It looks like a Tops dynasty numbered out of five with a Wemby auto and a piece of event war memorabilia or his Jackie card that we've seen before. So that's the response we got from Stan, the Jackie patch guy. And he really does address a lot of the topics that we discussed last week about the card, about buying it on credit, which really is his business. I mean, he'll, he, you know, he'll live or die by that. That's. That's on him, right? We can talk about it. Sure. But. Okay. All that said, I want to go to the panel and get your initial thought. I think it's only, Only appropriate that we start with that. We start with my good buddy Joshua Adams. Josh, what do you. What do you think of the email and Stan's position on things? I don't know. According to Daniel Brown, I don't know if he cooked me, but I don't. I don't really understand what he's saying. Like, is he saying I'm a PSA fanboy, which, you know, couldn't be farther from the truth? No, I. I think. Sorry, go ahead, finish off. I don't understand what you're trying to say. Like, I, I think paying for a sticker on your cart for Someone to tell you that it's a nice eye appeal card is ridiculous. That's true, but I don't. I don't really understand what his point is. I think he's talking about where he says here, Josh, that your argument that there's a hundred different Jackie Jersey cards out there. He's saying. He's saying that's ridiculous, but he's saying, you're right, but it's a ridiculous argument. Those are not of the same caliber. So. But then again, you know, to your point, Josh, really, like, some people just want to have a peace of a player's jersey. Like, just owning a piece, whether a napkin patch or more interesting patch, is still a piece of that history. So for that, I see your point on that. But I also be. As a person who loves patch cards and likes them to be nice and interesting, I see what he's saying. That, you know, just because there are all those p. All those other napkin patch jersey pieces out there, it doesn't really make this piece any worse. So I think that's what he's getting at. I don't think he was talking about. And I don't see anything. I. I'm not reading into any PSA fanboy stuff there. I didn't get the rubber band comment, though. I guess I don't. What's his point with the rubber band? That I'm. That I. That I don't understand. You know, he says. He says there are people in the hobby who only collect base kind of stuff. I think he's talking about people who just collect traditional cards. And he says. And he's. And he's making a. He's taking a big leap here to say that these are mostly vintage guys with rubber bands around their inventory. And I think what he's meaning there is, like. Because I know when I go to the. I go to a card show and there's vintage and I go by the booth that are like the. The showcases are all hacked up. You can't see through them. And then there's just stacks of stacks and stacks of cards literally in rubber bands. They're often. They're often in semi rigids, and then they're in rubber bands. You know, they're not graded. They're just the raw cards being waiting to be bought. I don't. I don't stop at those tables. I don't want to look through those. I feel like I'm gonna. Like my hands. I'm gonna contaminate my hands after I touch those. That's Josh, you And I joke around about dust. We called, we call vintage. Yeah, right. I think he's talking about the, like the, the dust peddlers, if you will. Not high quality ones. But anyway, yeah, that's what I think he's saying. And, and what he's also saying is that, you know, he does mention that rubber bands around their inventory and the only distinction they make in a card is the PSA grade. So I think what he's saying, which I think is true in a lot of cases, that people just collect the grade. So I don't think that had anything to do with you. Although I could be wrong. I could be wrong. No, it's interesting. No, I mean, hey, it's a cool car. The guy likes it. He likes it. You know, I'm not going to tell someone what to collect, but just don't collect that sticker. But yeah, otherwise it's fine. I, I did get a chuckle when he did. When, when, you know, he. What does he say? He says, I. Something like, I don't think. I don't see him as a visionary or something like that. He might be a titan of the industry. Doesn't strike me as a visionary, though. I think you are a visionary, Josh. You are a visionary. I can tell you that for a fact. You are a visionary. You started a company, 90s auctions. No one else had done that. You started one of the first niche auctions in the space. So you are a visionary. But again, he doesn't know you. So. Okay. Congratulations on your card, Stan. Very nice. Yeah. Okay. Okay. How about you, Chris? You got any, anything to add to this? And even something that's from your notes for. You have for Joe last time. Whatever you want, Chris. First of all, Josh is absolutely a visionary. Let's just get that straight. I'm not, I don't, I don't know that what he envisions is very good, but he sees it. He's. He's definitely seeing things that none of us can see. Okay. I have so much to say on this topic, Jeremy, so can you give me a limit here? Should I go for two minutes? Should I go for longer? Go. You know what? We've got, we're. We've got 20 minutes left in the regularly scheduled program and we're. Last year, last week we went for another hour 20. So you got time. You can take five, 10 minutes if you want. All right, good. I'll take 30 minutes. All right. No, what we. What. Here's what I think, Jeremy. I think this is a great ongoing saga I'm glad that you brought it out. Last week I was mortified a bit on behalf of Stan just because he got beat up a little bit at some points, which is fine. When you put yourself out there in public, that's going to happen, especially when sort of like, it's, it's third party. It's like reading text, you know, like, it really becomes a canvas that almost anything can be projected onto. So I thought that was a very clever bit of content that I really liked. Like I said, I was, I was so interested and I just downloaded a ton of thoughts onto Joe. You know, Joe is just like, oh, neat. So, so that, so, okay, so I love this as a recurring content bit, like a miniseries or something. And here's what I think about Stan. First of all, you know, I get a lot of the words of caution that were aimed at, and I think that, that it was, I think a lot of really wise things were offered up. And I, I just think a conservative approach on financial matters is prudent. However, I've never been the most prudent person or the most conservative person. And I, I, I, I really take inspiration when a, when a collector takes a huge swing and they swing for the fences, and sometimes they connect and sometimes they don't. But, man, I like, I like swinging for the fences. And that's what he did. And then, you know, you can kind of tell yourself, hey, you shoot for the stars, and then maybe you only land in the sky and maybe that's what ends up happening here and then. But now, to get more context, he's gonna work it off for the summer, right? He's gonna, he's gonna work a whole summer to pay off this card, man. Isn't that like, does that do something to you? Does that kind of like, give you a little life, Give you a little extra pep in your step? Just thinking about a guy who's like, yeah, I'm gonna bust my butt this summer to pay off a card that I think is awesome. And I, I'm having so much fun that I'm gonna email one of my favorite content creators about it, or, I don't know, maybe you are his favorite content creator. And like, I'm just gonna, just, he's just, this is a guy who, who shoots his shot, you know, not just in bidding on this card, but also then reaching out to you because you could just as easily have him like, whatever, buddy, this goes to the junk folder or whatever. Okay, so having said that, now here's my final point. Now what would I do. If I were in his shoes and what I do. One of the funniest interactions I've ever had was with John Burleson at a Dallas card show a few years ago. And we were kind of like chatting back and forth and he goes, yeah, sometimes I just buy a card and then I research it later. Like, I just hope that I bought something cool and it was for a good price, but I don't really know what I was buying at the time. And then I figured out later and I was like, yeah, I totally do that all the time too. It's like it just happens. But really, that's not ideal. Really, that's not optimal. Ideally, we. I've spent like the last two or three years really emphasizing for myself and for anybody who cares to listen to my philosophies that I think doing comprehensive research is such an edge, it can be dangerous because as we do a lot of research, we discover all these things we didn't know existed. And all of a sudden we can want to have so many things like it can spiral. But doing comprehensive research is really important. And so now you already have the cards. That part's already done. What I would do next is I would start figuring out how to properly tell the story of this card if it were me. I'm not saying that this is what he should do because everybody has their own methods, but if it were me, I'd want to right away. And this is something I started talking to Joe about a little bit. Okay, how many Jackie 1 of ones exist? Let me start there. Let me build a sandbox of Jackie Robinson. One of ones. How many exist? And what was the first one? Maybe this is the first one. I don't know. It's not. I've looked. But just like, hypothetically speaking, maybe this is the first one. How exciting would that be right now you got this whole extra tagline that goes along with the card. Okay, but it's not his first. All right, but is, is it his first, you know, patch card or his first patch? 1 of 1. Or if it's not, how many, how many came before it and how many exist total and what are all the brands that they come from? Because like, I think the Jackie 1 of 1 sandbox is a little bit too broad of a sandbox. There's probably not many. You can make an even smaller sandbox because the game worn memorabilia adds something to this card. So like, really my next research question would be now, once I know how many one of one Jackie's exist, how many Game worn memorabilia, one of ones of Jackie exist. I bet that's a pretty small number. And then once I know how many of those exist, where does this one fit into that hierarchy? You know, is it what. What's. What makes it special? I assure you there are things that make it special, but what are they? Is. Is it the first or is it. Is it one of the first products to have one? Or does it feature a special image of him? Or is there something special about the product that it comes from? There's something limited about the product that it comes from. Is there. There's, I think comes from playoff Don Russ maybe. Is. Is it. Is that particular. How many times did Jackie have game worn relic, one of ones in a playoff Don Russ product? And all of a sudden, what if there's like four cards or like five cards that meet that definition? Now all of a sudden I have this amazing story to tell about a card that flows from all this research that I've done that was inspired by the fact that I now own the card. So, like, in that way, a card can be a gift of collecting that keeps on giving. And I'll give one concrete example of how this worked for me and then I'll stop. The last card that I posted to my Instagram page was a Brock Purdy card, a player not many people care about or excited or are excited about. And the card that I posted was a card that I picked up last summer at the national from a friend of mine who was looking to get out of his Brock Purdy cards. And I was his exit plan and one of the. One of the ones that he sold to me like it was. They were both rookie year base at one of ones. And that's enough for me. Like, I know that Purdy only has roughly 30 first appearing base at rookie or one of one parallels. So I was really excited just on that alone. But on a hunch, I thought to myself, you know, I've never really looked too deeply into the chronology of Purdy's rookie year issues. Do I own his first one of one just on a hunch? Like I have like five or six of them or maybe even a little bit more. And I said, is there any chance that I could own Purdy's first one of one? And so I went to trading card database. I looked up the release dates for every single Purdy rookie year product, and he doesn't have any cards that are prior to his rookie year that are one of ones. And I found out that one of the Purdy cards that I own is not his first one of one. That's a. That comes from Chronicles Collegiate. But I did end up owning Purdy's first NFL licensed one of one. His first 49ers branded one of one. That was amazing. That, like, that inspired me to write a whole Instagram post and to like, take pictures of it and do a whole thing. And I'm probably gonna make like a podcast episode about it. And this was just like a small card that I bought last summer. I had no idea, did the research, found out something incredibly exciting about the card, and now it tells an amazing story. And you know what else? That card shines brighter now that I know that story. Knowing that it's his first NFL license, his first 49ers branded one of one makes that card literally shine brighter when I hold in my hand. So. And that's. That's the gift that this card will keep giving is the gift of research and storytelling. If it tells a story as compelling as the one that you're able to tell with your Brock Purdy. Right. Like there. But it seems like there's a good chance that it will, you know, there. It's. It's a. It's. It's a nice card. It's got a lot. Just. Just a cut in brief. And then I know I've rambled here. Every card tells a great story. Every card tells a great story that it is incumbent on the collector to figure out what it is. But every. I could tell a great story about any card that was ever made. Just give me enough time to figure it out. Okay, but. But there. I'm a little skeptical, but let me just say, because you said I could tell a good story about every card. But you must be able to set like if, if the baseline is good story. There must be some amazing, exceptionally interesting stories out there. Because really, can every card ever made. Tell a. Tell a. A good story or tell a story? Like. Like, I guess if you're gonna. If you're gonna dive into the player and what, what they did for their community and those sorts of things. But then does that make one card better than the other card? You know, you gotta. Maybe you gotta find the picture the game was taken from, like, I guess. I guess. Okay. I guess you could. You could tell a good story about any card. I think some cards are going to tell much better stories, though. So that's fair. I think that's fair, right? We agree on that. Absolutely. Yeah. Okay. How about you, David Chase? Any thoughts on anything we've talked about since we started this topic. Yeah. I mean, man, this guy's passion is hardcore. I don't think I have ever written or read an email that long in my entire life. So I'm impressed with that already. I really like his passion. All right, I'm going to mention, I know that you don't want to talk about his financial. No, yeah, because you know what, don't include it in the email if you don't want us to talk about it. Right? No, that's me. He doesn't care. That was me saying. But listen, go ahead, talk about all you want. Yeah, I think it's totally irresponsible, right. For what he's doing. And I understand that it's okay to be irresponsible. We all are able to. We all have credit cards. Right. There's a lot of people in credit card debt in the world. He's not the first person to do it. But I just think when you're, when you're living paycheck to paycheck like he is, he has a kid in college, they don't have extra money. I don't think going into debt without telling your spouse and to use a line of credit is the most financially prudent thing to do. I know he says that he understands that, but does that mean that the family doesn't go on vacation this summer? Possibly. I think that that's something that you should probably discuss with the family. But you do you, my friend. Another thing, don't pick on my friend Josh, okay? My buddy Josh here. It's okay to have different opinions. Right? That's why you're bringing this detention. And like there were people when I was trying to buy my Leaf Jackie card that were telling me that I was absolutely crazy for spending the money I was thinking about spending. That was way above a PSA one. I liked hearing those opinions. It's okay to get those different opinions because that's what makes you well rounded. And you want to kind of be able to combat them without just saying you like old cards and rubber bands. Little childish to respond that way, but I still love you. But don't make fun of my buddy Josh. I'll defend him till my death. Thanks for tuning in and being a part of the sports cards live community. Don't forget to like subscribe and most of all, keep collecting more great content to come. Sports cars is a lifestyle.